精华 讨论:本次美国大选

美国大选:上帝与现实之间的选择

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亚洲时报


“为了保卫我们伟大的祖国,我们将向地球四周出口死亡和暴力”。-引自鲍勃
・伍德沃德的着作《攻击计划》中美国总统布什的话。伊拉克无疑就是布什出口
“死亡和暴力”的物件之一。大部分美国人会不会因为布什发动了一场站不住脚
的先发制人的战争而拒绝投他一票呢?不管选举结果如何都改变不了一个事实:
至少全国一半地区和大部分文化和知识界精英都把布什看作是分裂者而不是统一
者。

美国人面临的选择很明显,他们要在以信仰为基础、有大企业撑腰的“救世主”
布什和得到现实派精英支援的克里之间做出选择。对布什政府来说,权力创造现
实,而傲慢是一个外来词。一位布什政府高层在接受《纽约时报》记者采访时说
:“美国现在是一个帝国。当我们行动时,我们就创造了我们自己的现实。当你
们正在研究那个现实时……我们又开始了创造其他新现实的行动;当你们又开始
研究这些新现实时,我们又开始了新的行动,情况就是这样。我们是历史的缔造
者,而你们所有其他人只能研究我们的历史。”这是布什政府无视现实的典型例
证和傲慢自大。

布什政府做了什么?

在今年春末初夏之际,《亚洲时报在线》记者来了一次美国公路之旅。在共和民
主两党全国大会前的阿布格莱布虐俘丑闻期间,布什和克里的全国支援率为45%
对 45%,剩下10%为游离选民。现在这一比率约为48%比48%,游离选民只剩下
4%。我们看到了小人物(生活在郊区购物商场、速食店和教堂之间的狭小空间的
工人阶级)与所谓的自由精英(被斥为“喝波尔多葡萄酒的道德败坏的同性恋和
无神论者”)之间的巨大鸿沟。

简言之,我们发现美国“红州”(传统上支援共和党的州)支援经过政治顾问卡
尔・罗夫包装而呈现出坚决果断、说话喜欢直来直去形象的布什,发现这些敬畏
上帝、反对枪支控制、反对堕胎、反对干细胞研究和反对联合国的新教徒捍卫真
正的“美国价值观”,他们对所谓的自由精英的厌恶正好为共和党的宣传机器所
用。卡尔・马克思、托洛茨基和毛泽东永远也想不到,广大工人阶级竟然支援一
个为全国1%最富有阶层减税、完全致力于摧毁维护工人阶级利益的民间组织的政
党。

这些支援布什的选举大军和布什本人一样本质上具有强烈的反知识和反现代化情
结,也难怪这种情结演变成了一种丑陋且具有攻击性的美国民族主义。“其他人
”-尤其是那些外国穆斯林另类成了他们不共戴天的敌人。布什政府对911事件做
出的反应是“反恐战”-用一种受误导的手段(战争)去对付一个概念(恐怖主
义)。但“反恐战”的概念非常绝妙,因为它使这种丑陋的救世主式的美国民族
主义与共和党的政策“水乳交融”了。

因此,布什宣称没有任何人能取代他作为三军总司令的位置:毕竟他是上帝的使
者,来完成上帝的使命。他向数百万等待耶稣复活的信徒表示,耶稣将重返人间
消灭所有人-只有他们除外。布什对现实世界的典型敌视正好反映了这些敬畏上
帝的东征十字军的认知偏差:难怪布什政府生活在奇幻乐园。

假如约翰・克里赢得大选,那么他无疑是得到了大部分工人阶级选民、绝大部分
女性选民、绝大部分西班牙裔选民、绝大部分黑人选民、多数18-30岁的年轻选
民,当然还有那些喝波尔多葡萄酒的文化精英的支援。但这些人能否压住敬畏上
帝的十字军呢?

这是什么样的选举?

这不是全国选举:这是51个独立州,包括华盛顿特区的选举。这些选举并不是100%
的民主,因为它们不是直接选举。这意味着对将近40个州的选民来说,他们说什
么或做什么根本无足轻重。真正决定总统选举结果的是那些游离州,大致包括:
阿肯色州、科罗拉多州、佛罗里达州、爱荷华州、明尼苏达州、内华达州、新罕
布夏州、俄亥俄州、宾夕法尼亚州、西佛吉尼亚州和威斯康星州。

根据最后的6个全国民调结果,其中4个显示布什最多领先克里3个百分点,其余两
个显示克里最多领先布什2个百分点。布什目前的平均支援率为47.9%,这对一位
在职总统来说实在是太差了。《福克斯新闻》自上周五开始每日公布的民调结果
是:上周五布什高5个百分点;上周六布什高2个百分点;周日两人扯平;周一克
里高2个百分点。一周前布什在处理伊拉克和恐怖主义问题上得到的支援率分别高
克里14和22个百分点,现在两者已持平。

本・拉登在选举前2天突然现身半岛电视台也许对布什有利,因为他的出现为选举
增添了恐怖气氛,但与此同时,似乎令选民更加愤怒的是,911事件过去3年多后
拉登竟然还丝毫无损地活着(不禁使人怀疑布什所吹嘘的“反恐战”)。正如笔
者几天前报道的那样,尽管美国大部分媒体只字不提,但布什政府在托拉博拉一
战中将追捕拉登的任务外包给阿富汗军阀转而仓促发动伊战的事实不会就此被美
国选民遗忘。令人惊讶的是,拉登在讲话中并没有像布什政府宣传的那样威胁向
美国发起新的攻击。

不难猜测这次选举的投票人数将会很多。在2000年, 2.03亿合格选民中仅有1.11亿
参加了投票,投票率为55%。许多民调机构预测这次投票人数至少将达到1.2亿。
目前关于全国的共和党选民与黑人选民做交易、迫使他们支援共和党的传闻引起
了激烈的批评,不过共和党的民调公司Fabrizio, McLaughlin & Associates说:
如果克里失去了黑人选民,这次选举肯定有问题。根据该机构的调查结果,克里
在所有游离州可能领先布什5个百分点

一次埋葬新保守派的选举

从这次选举引起的高度关注来看,这堪称是一次世界选举。美国人可能在一个相
当愚蠢的问题上两极分化:你喜欢还是痛恨另一个候选人?世界其他国家的人民
已经做出选择。根据“全球扫描”和马里兰大学对全球35个国家进行的联合调查
,绝大部分(30个)国家支援克里:克里赢得了2/3的受访者的支援。即使是保守
派刊物《金融时报》和《经济学家》也已表示支援克里:这本质上意味着布什在
经济方面的失败。

根据德国《明镜周刊》的一份调查,79%的德国人都希望克里当选。西班牙日报
《世界报》的网站一直在呼吁美国西班牙裔选民支援克里。墨西哥着名小说家、
对美国推崇备至的福恩特斯哀叹在布什领导下的美国已经成为“自大而无能的超
级霸主,像科学怪人一样控制不了它过去保护的恶魔,如暴君萨达姆和恐怖首脑
拉登”,并且让国防部长拉姆斯费尔德这样的“吸血鬼”重权在握。中国前副总
理钱其琛也猛烈抨击布什的外交政策。

这是一次埋葬新保守派的选举。正如斯蒂芬・哈尔波和乔纳森・克拉克在其着作
《美国孤立:新保守主义和全球秩序》(康桥大学出版社2004年6月出版)中指出
的:“新保守派认为他们生活在霍布斯哲学中提到的弱肉强食的世界,在这个世
界中为获得支配地位的军事竞争永远存在,国家间不可能相安无事;在这个世界
中洛克或卢梭提出的社会契约对国家来说是一种幻觉,必须在敌人(任何不赞同
新保守派世界观者都被视为敌人)消灭你之前向他发起先发制人的攻击。”

只需8位元新保守派就控制了整个美国政府,他们的职位分别是国防部负责近东和
南亚事务的助理国防部长、负责政策的助理国防部长、副国防部长、国防部长、
负责武器控制的副国务卿、国防政策委员会主席、副总统和副国家安全顾问等)
。他们都是极右翼组织“新美国世纪工程”的成员,并且都是以色列利库德集团
的支持者-两者自20世纪90年代中以来一直在呼吁向伊拉克开战。

这是一次埋葬代总统迪克・切尼的选举,这位代总统可谓是超级机密、反民主和
在伊拉克重建合同上任人唯亲的布什政府的总设计师。但事实是这种建立在不现
实基础上的模式确实奏效。

数位胜于雄辩。根据各种调查,布什的支持者中仍有55%相信伊拉克曾庇护阿尔
盖达;72%相信伊拉克有WMD或发展WMD的计划;69%相信布什支援《全面禁止核
子试验条约》;61%相信如果布什知道伊拉克没有WMD可能不会对它宣战;60%相
信伊拉克曾支援阿尔盖达;58%相信刚出炉的迪尔费尔报告内容:伊拉克要么拥有
WMD,要么有发展WMD的重大计划;51%相信布什支援限制温室气体排放的《京都
议定书》;以及20%仍相信伊拉克直接卷入了911 事件。

伊拉克的反恐记录

由约翰・霍普金斯大学、哥伦比亚大学和巴格达al-Mustansariya大学最近公布的
一份联合调查报告指出,约10万伊拉克人死于战火,其中大部分是被盟军误杀的
妇女和儿童。

国家安全顾问赖斯应该引咎辞职或被解除职务,因为她没有阻止布什根据错误情
报或不合格的分析而发动一场先发制人的战争。拉姆斯费尔德也应该引咎辞职或
被解除职务,因为美军在他的领导下发生了阿布格莱布虐俘丑闻、关塔那摩X射线
营的侵犯人权事件及阿富汗和伊拉克两次损失惨重的错误战争。

2001年8月6日中情局的一份报告写道:“本・拉登决心要袭击美国”。布什对此
的反应是休了一个月的长假。当工作人员告诉布什恐怖分子劫持的飞机撞向世贸
双塔时,布什的反应是继续听小学生们朗诵《我的宠物山羊》。他反对成立911事
件调查委员会,并且只聆听该机构中切尼亲信的报告。受新保守派的蛊惑,他执
行弱肉强食的军事政策,疏远美国在全球的主要盟友并嘲笑联合国是多余的机构
。伊拉克没有WMD,但巴基斯坦和北韩倒有不少。

为何对911事件的报复变成了对伊拉克的灾难性占领,没有人给出合理的解释。德
国的汉堡(911大部分阴谋也许就是在那里策划)和佛罗里达的好莱坞(几名劫机
犯都曾在那里生活)都比伊拉克与911事件更有关联。为何除了喀布尔外阿富汗其
他地区仍然是军阀割据,民不聊生,而塔利班和阿尔盖达依然在巴基斯坦-阿富
汗边境活动猖獗,也没有人给出合理的解释。

在2000年,并不是大多数美国人选择了布什。如果今年他真的再次当选-不管有
没有大部分选民的支援,这将向全世界发出一个重大资讯:美国人支援新保守派
的政策。布什当选的后果不难预料:更多的减税、更有强制性的《爱国者法案》
、中东地区出现更多的战事和混乱以及十字军“向地球四周出口死亡和暴力”的
行动可能合法化。反之,进步的美国将重新面对现实,并惩罚布什政府不合法的
失常行为。
 
从美国大选结束看美国的民主

龙之醒



  今天美国的总统新鲜出笼了,被人骂了四年的乔治.小布什先生在他老冤家笨
.拉登先生临门一脚的助阵下,再次以不大的优势得到再执政四年的机会,多少令
世界爱好和平的人民失望了。


  在前不久的总统竞选辩论会上,克里看上去还是信心十足,雄辩如流,理论
充分,而小布什则语无伦次,尽处下风。就连应该保持中立的著名媒体《纽约时
报》也批评布什说谎,甚至说他根本不能认识到什么是现实世界。而迈克.摩尔的
《华氏911》小投资大回报,以揭小布什老底的话题得到美国以及世界人民的欢迎
。可就算这一切的一切都是对的,克里是人中表率,优秀的政治家,而布什就是
个脑袋简单的糟糕人物,但布什就是连任了。这事在号称最民主、最法治,国民
智慧最高的美国发生,听起来好像荒堂,但其实当然有个中道理。


  为什么?笔者倒是以为美国人的民主概念中有一个越来越明显的倾向,就是
能够接受总统不必是个好孩子。


  记得以前看过马克.吐温的《竞选州长》,在那个年代美国的竞选中就充满了
人格攻击和相互抹黑,可见当时美国人选举,都要选一个各方面都出色的人物当
领导,用中国的话说,讲究“德才兼备”。但现在来看,这个“德才兼备”的标
准对美国选民来说不好使了。


  四年前,戈尔就是德才兼德的上上之选,堪称完美人物,从小就是好孩子,
在大学各项成绩都远超布什,在家里是好丈夫、好父亲,当副手是精明强干,为
人处事更是无可挑剔,再拿中国人的话说,是组织久经考验的领导干部,如果人
民委以重任,一定能带着美国人民从胜利走向胜利,结果怎么样?布什胜了。现
在民主党不长进,又整了一个同样个方面都优秀的克里,甚至身高长相都比布什
强,结果又输了。其实美国人已经不再把总统当成什么神圣工作,选总统又不是
选男朋友,对总统的要求可能还比不上对自己正在上大学的儿子的要求选格。选
总统,但是不崇拜自己选的这个总统,这是美国人民主的一种“崇高”境界。当
年,克林顿的丑闻全世界扩散,但克林顿在美国人民心目中的地位,不但没有垮
掉,反而呈现上扬,最近好像又要选联合国秘书长。小克退任后,在一家餐厅吃
饭,一位姑娘过来就脱衣服要他在上面签名。这个不忠的丈夫,却得到了大多数
女性的原谅。


  由此来看小布什。你笨,绝对没问题,没准因为你笨美国人民还更喜欢你。
你要是各方面都表现比我好长得帅,我首先看你就不爽,怎么能选你呢。再说现
在的决策都是智囊圈在那出谋划策,总统无非是利益阶层的代言人而已。施瓦辛
格演员出身不懂政治,人家在加州当州长一样干得不错嘛。


  所以,笔者估计美国人对总统只有一个要求,只要你站在我们这一边。美国
人想,我反对坠胎,我看不惯同性恋结婚,我认为美国就应该对外强硬管闲事,
我是共和党这边的,所以我就选布什。美国人选总统甚至比某些公司董事会选CEO还
简单,对候选人的要求考察还要低,这就是美国的民主新境界。用这种态度选领
导人好还是不好,笔者并不能说出个所以然,但是可以肯定,一人一票的选举制
度发展到一定程度就会达到这种境界。为什么?因为选的次数多了,老百姓就什
么人都见过了,国家也被什么人都把持过了,老百姓反倒被弄得“不敏感”了。
所以,美国的民主发展到最后,就成为一些政治秀客们秀场工具,这是美国的民
主精华之极至。现在中国大陆有些人总在拿美国当干爹,动辙拿美国当行为导师
,而美国的民主更令他们神往,哪怕是选出了发动战争,残害生灵如无物的混蛋
也依然不变。但中国应该怎么学美国?还是看官们自己好好想想吧。
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: 讨论:本次美国大选

最初由 渐渐 发布
Canadian media that is.


实际上,因为克里要取消北美自由贸易区协议,加拿大人更希望布什当选。
 
LOL check this out

new_map.jpg
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 讨论:本次美国大选

An overwhelming 70% and more Canadians wish to have Kerry elected, which coincides with Canadian's liberal thinking.


最初由 玉树临风 发布


实际上,因为克里要取消北美自由贸易区协议,加拿大人更希望布什当选。
 
Many analysts say that the only Democrats that could be elected president of the US are from the South, like Carter and Clinton.


最初由 人淡如菊 发布
LOL check this out

new_map.jpg
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 讨论:本次美国大选

最初由 渐渐 发布
An overwhelming 70% and more Canadians wish to have Kerry elected, which coincides with Canadian's liberal thinking.



Canadians and many Europeans have been living in peace (under US protection) for so many years and that, I think, is the main contributor to the overwhelmingly left-wing socialism and idealism.

On the other hand, many anti-Bush people chose to speak out, like the notorious anti-globalization protestors who made a lot of noises. The real sentiment among average people may not be that anti-bush.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 讨论:本次美国大选

最初由 msft 发布


Canadians and many Europeans have been living in peace (under US protection) for so many years and that, I think, is the main contributor to the overwhelmingly left-wing socialism and idealism.

On the other hand, many anti-Bush people chose to speak out, like the notorious anti-globalization protestors who made a lot of noises. The real sentiment among average people may not be that anti-bush.

I don't see any direct connection between living in peace and left wing. Could you give more details on your reasoning? I think social structure such as welfare and medicare play big role of affecting people's perception of government and social values. On top of that, religion has much weaker influence in EU, it makes EU less conservative too.

Real sentiment among most democrats are very upset, very anti-Bush, as far as I can feel.

anti-globalization are mostly from union. But not all union members support Kerry. There are many strong union presence in red states too. Like I said before, I think for this election, most people chose "moral" values. Democrats chose gay marriage, stem cell, abortion while Rep chose to against them. Kerry bet on war on Iraq and economy but most people took them as secondary. Look, Canadian chose Kerry even though he is negative on NAFTA. Democrats hate Bush before the war and would still hate him if economy were great now. This is why the election has wraped in so much emotion.

BTW, I do want to say that I admire American people for their belief in democracy, their acceptance of democratic results...
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 讨论:本次美国大选

最初由 msft 发布


Canadians and many Europeans have been living in peace (under US protection) for so many years and that, I think, is the main contributor to the overwhelmingly left-wing socialism and idealism.

On the other hand, many anti-Bush people chose to speak out, like the notorious anti-globalization protestors who made a lot of noises. The real sentiment among average people may not be that anti-bush.

Well, you shouldn't mix up anti-bush with anti-america. I don't think many Canadian and European are against American, they are just against Bush, or to be more specific, his foreign policy. Yes, Canada and Europe should thanks American for protecting them in cold world, but it doesn't mean that they should thank Bush for invading Iraq.
 
Re: the fall of a great empire

最初由 kentridge 发布
this is the start of the falling of a great country. Especially, when the leader of the country only can resolve conflicts by force and when the people in the country only believe they are the greatest and become so arrogant to look down upon any others in the world.

They lost the chance of a change. An opportunity to reassess the global situation and their true situation, the jeopardy that will destroy themselves. Since Bush was their choice, they have to stick on with his wrong policies for anther four years. The outcome can be very dangerous.

No super power will last forever if you look back of the history of mankind. Whenever the greatest turns the blind eyes toward the outside world and whenever the country only care its own interest and abuse others, and finally whenever their only way of dealing with others is by force, it will destroy the greatest itself no matter how glorious it looks like now.

As experts predicted, the nuclear bomb will be dropped to this land sooner or later. And another truly super power is rising. This will open the new chapter of the history of human being. I am sad for Americans and excited to see the new super power, China to replace USA.

It seems indeed is the beginning of the falling of a great power, unless Bush change his policies and approaches.
Great power come and go in human history. Tang's dynasty in china, then UK, and now U.S.
China's rising? I am not sure. probably eventually, but at least not in a short run. it has many fundamental problems that need to be solve.
 
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最初由 Broken Arrow 发布


I don't see any direct connection between living in peace and left wing. Could you give more details on your reasoning? I think social structure such as welfare and medicare play big role of affecting people's perception of government and social values. On top of that, religion has much weaker influence in EU, it makes EU less conservative too.

...

There is no direct connection between them, true. But extreme socialism and idealism can only be possible when there is peace and no imminent threat (Or, there is always threat, but some "big brother" protects you, so you don't have to worry about that.)

Socialism and idealism simply don't have the environment to grow in a country under constant threat.

Of course, there is excpetion - if that nation has a tradition of surrender.
 
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最初由 lifeisfun 发布


Well, you shouldn't mix up anti-bush with anti-america. I don't think many Canadian and European are against American, they are just against Bush, or to be more specific, his foreign policy. Yes, Canada and Europe should thanks American for protecting them in cold world, but it doesn't mean that they should thank Bush for invading Iraq.

Anti-Bush, outside of US, is simply another form of anti-America.

Invading Iraq provided them a nearly-perfect excuse to blame Bush ( representing USA).
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 讨论:本次美国大选

I disagree with your "under US protection" view. I think the Bush administration's current foreign policies are in fact a major contributor to global instability, and that those policies will put Americans at greater risk of terrorist attacks.

To respond to your "under US protection" and the implicit "we live in peace because of US" view, I'll quote a famous passage from Col. Jessup played by Jack Nicholson in the Movie "A Few Good Men", which I believe pretty much summarizes what Pro-Bushers think:

Jack Nicholson (Col. Jessup): Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Whose gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinburg? I have more responsibility here than you could possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago, and you curse the marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives. And that my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. I know deep down in places you dont talk about at parties, you don't want me on that wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then question the manner in which I provide it. I prefer you said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand to post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to!

:)

最初由 msft 发布


Canadians and many Europeans have been living in peace (under US protection) for so many years and that, I think, is the main contributor to the overwhelmingly left-wing socialism and idealism.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 讨论:本次美国大选

最初由 msft 发布


There is no direct connection between them, true. But extreme socialism and idealism can only be possible when there is peace and no imminent threat (Or, there is always threat, but some "big brother" protects you, so you don't have to worry about that.)

Socialism and idealism simply don't have the environment to grow in a country under constant threat.

Of course, there is excpetion - if that nation has a tradition of surrender.

hehe, do you mean France? That is not very nice...

Back to your point, if you think USA was under constant thread so it didn't develop Socialism and idealism, then NATO is directly under threat at its member's border, wasn't it?

I think American tends to be independent and wants to be independent largly because of their recent history. This country was built by people who came bare-handed. They built their home first before building their government. So they were not dependent on government and many of them were forced out of their home land because their previous government so they naturally distrust government in general. To run a universal social wellfare system, you need a big bureaucrat body, government, ideally efficient, but generally not...
 
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