加拿大总理将会晤达赖 引起大的争议

[剑寒九州]

http://jczsbbs1.sina.com.cn/cgi-bin/view.cgi?gid=5&fid=34&thread=150581&date=20040408

 

[wwt]

最初由 Final 发布


论典范,

美国是比较差的,典范应该是加拿大和法国!


中国就喜欢和比较差的比!!!

你凭什么说美国比较差？美国这么强大，这么有钱.......................

你说的那两个典范，美国人根本就不理他们，嚷嚷了半天，仗还不是照打。难道让中国和他们比？

 

[toisanlao]

最初由 FallColor 发布

Oh, my God! you don't read news and certainly don't read Martin's words.

Putting words in my mouth would not advance your arguement in any way. You have no clue whether I read any newspapers or watch news. Stick to the points instead of character assassination.

He said himself he doesn't support the war-from his own mouth!

Quote me any article in which he openly supported Chretien's decision not to participate in the Iraq invasion with the US BEFORE the war broke out. Don't quote me what he says now. He is a politician, after knowing 70% and more Canadians opposed the war, he would not be so stupid as to openly supporting it right now as it's an afterfact.

The following is a quote, taken from http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/nov2003/mart-n22.shtml :

Thus last spring, shortly after Chrétien had said the lack of UN Security Council authorization made it impossible for Canada to join in the US war on Iraq, Martin, without publicly criticizing that decision, proclaimed that Canada must be ready to wage wars without UN approval. Similarly, without publicly attacking Chrétien, he has repeatedly said that repairing relations with the Bush administration will be among his foremost priorities and called for a sharp increase in Canada’s military budget.

The above is Martin's way of silent consent. Who blamed him for doing this? After all, he is a politician.

You really don't understand what I was saying.
I did not say Democracy and patriotism are mutually exclusive. They certainly aren't. But sometimes, so called "Patriotism" does get into the way of democracy. And I certainly agreed that the American is very patriotic. That's exactly my point!!!! Bush used and promoted and twisted it to his advance his own interestes!

I still do not understand what you were trying to say. Please clarify once more. Previously, you cited that "To me democracy makes more sense than patriotism". And now, you are saying "Patriotism does get into the way of democracy". You are clearly linking the two together as one may influence the other. By the way, where you were truly trying to say is "Patriotism does get in the way of democracy".

What I was saying is that "democracy" and "patriotism" are orthogonal. That is, promoting democracy does not mean one needs to give up patriotism. I used the USA as a good example of that.

Man! do you really know/understand exactly what this phase mean " IN THE NAME OF" if you really do you won't argue with me.

After having lived here for over 20 years, I believe I understand that phrase. But just in case, why don't you, Mr. Linguist, explain explain it here so everyone could benefit from it, besides me?

oh, man! have you ever heard or Bush said" we invaded Iraq to fight for control of oil" ???? No, he basically telling the American people"we rid of the evil in the world to make America a safe place...bla..bla.."

And your point is? Do your or don't you believed what he said? Do you or don't believe the real real reason for invading Iraq is not to make America a safer place? or is it the control of oil or some other imperialistic motives?

Why U.S fight for ideologies???-because they think their ideology is the best in the whole wild world!!!- in other word-blinded/overheated patriotism!

I used 'fight for ideologies' as the main reason for the American involvements in Vietnam and Korea, in refuting your point "Look at all of the wars in the world, which one isn't in the name of Patriotism?" This, my friend, has nothing absolutely whatsoever to do with patriotism. Many liberals and students in the US during the Vietnam and Korea Wars were vehemently opposed to those wars. Nontheless, they were as patriotic as the others.

you are arguing for the sake of arguing.

Another personal attack...stick to the issues...

 

[FallColor]

Are you really a "tai san lao"? - I from same province->GouangZhou.
If you put it that way, you can even argue Chretien opposed the way is also self-interested only - ex. he has tied in France.
"Silent Consent" ? - Can you judge people like that? at the very least he is not like the opposition party who openly suppose the war.
No point in arguing with you because you totally get me wrong. You don't get my points and don't know what I am saying.
Well, let me put it this way-I am basically anti-Bush.

There are two kind of patriotism:
1.love one's countries but also others'
2.Love one's countries exclusively only

I am not advocate people to give up patriotism(1 definition). I love my countries too (both Canada and China) but I also like other countries. I said many time I am opposed "SO CALLED/BLIDELY/OVERHEATED/SELF-CENTRIC" kind of patriotism(definition 2). Please pay attention to the capital words

Ideology absolutely has something to do with patriotism, my friend. because every country has different ideology. otherwise, what the heck do you care what ideology other people hold?

Don't be too presuming to call me "Mr. linguist" because I am no "Mr."

 

[子龙]

自以为是。

 

[带刀蚂蚁]

。。。