[狂想]假如台湾不是我们的有多好

阿童木

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We live happily without TW for last 50+ years. Even without it, the country has advanced so much in the last few decades and we are heading even more good time. Now we are facing this almost-inevitable war. Tens of thousand my bro and sis will die and even more will lose property and hard-earned opportunity of future development. This makes me mad and wish TW was never part of China!!

:flaming:

But unfortunately, it is.
 
在上?世硷寿介石把92万两的黄金偷到了胚海╋然后其中的82万两做了台湾新台币发行的准备额、准备金。然后台湾才开始所谓经济起飞,这么多年来台湾就变成了暴发户。可是这是用全中国的钱啊~~~~~~用会计学的说法是耽误了大陆发展的机会成本!你?50+year的快??光在哪?╋不是重中??的???台湾抢走了中国大陆国库的黄金,现在自己发了财,就想逃掉,哪有这么简单?

But unfortunately, it is.
 
Sigh, I wish it is all about gold and money.... But unfortunately, it is NOT.

Here is little math to satisfy Mr. Wu (the math guy :) ).

92 liang gold is about (1 liang [China] = 1.7636981 ounce) 1622K ounce at 1949's gold price (31.69USD/oz http://www.nma.org/pdf/gold/his_gold_prices.pdf) is 51.417 million USD, compounded @ interest rate of ~10% (which I think is somewhat reasonable since US stock only return 8.5% 1946-2001 http://www.aimrpubs.org/ap/issues/v2002n1/pdf/p0020035a.pdf) for 54 years is about 8.8 billion USD @ 2003. Now China's GDP is about 1.4 trillion dollar @ 2003. Now that is about a 2-day weekend's worth of GDP.

Now think how many ppl and money will be up in smoke to recover this debt which KMT owe us.

Disclaimer: I am a Chinese from mainland. I am aginst TD but also aginst forceful unification.
 
最初由 阿童木 发布

Disclaimer: I am a Chinese from mainland. I am aginst TD but also aginst forceful unification.

In large part, I agree with ur oppinion. The only solution is that both side across the TW Straight should agree with "one China" and try to avoid the war in this way. I can not see any other possible solution for this problem.It is too simple, but sometimes too complicated! It tests the wisdom of Chinese on both sides.
 
I sincerely wish all these keep-them-in-check-war-drum-beating in this site is part of the wisdom to prevent the war. If not, we ought to start prepare the post-war fallout.
 
最初由 阿童木 发布
Sigh, I wish it is all about gold and money.... But unfortunately, it is NOT.

Here is little math to satisfy Mr. Wu (the math guy :) ).

92 liang gold is about (1 liang [China] = 1.7636981 ounce) 1622K ounce at 1949's gold price (31.69USD/oz http://www.nma.org/pdf/gold/his_gold_prices.pdf) is 51.417 million USD, compounded @ interest rate of ~10% (which I think is somewhat reasonable since US stock only return 8.5% 1946-2001 http://www.aimrpubs.org/ap/issues/v2002n1/pdf/p0020035a.pdf) for 54 years is about 8.8 billion USD @ 2003. Now China's GDP is about 1.4 trillion dollar @ 2003. Now that is about a 2-day weekend's worth of GDP.

Now think how many ppl and money will be up in smoke to recover this debt which KMT owe us.

Disclaimer: I am a Chinese from mainland. I am aginst TD but also aginst forceful unification.
呵呵╋看?我攻?邋人了,不好意思啊:P
不咿嘱回?╋大??要用武力其?是?胚??铨的最低?╋在呃之上有很??的?判空殓。再?也是?胚海?铨的?心酌明╋不惜?中?的命哕?。其?也十分?酷╋不咿?了靳一什?是都是?办生。
 
最初由 thegayer 发布
不咿嘱回?╋大??要用武力其?是?胚??铨的最低?╋在呃之上有很??的?判空殓。再?也是?胚海?铨的?心酌明╋不惜?中?的命哕?。其?也十分?酷╋不咿?了靳一什?是都是?办生。

Besides my haterd for TD, I also very much strongly oppose using force. I feel it is NOT a practical option at all. It serves nothing positive to the fundamentals of unification cause of great China. On the contrary, it will undermine it over much longer period. Because even we win the war and we will not have the hearts of the people (even those of ppl vote aginst TD this time), thus we lost the cause. To reunite is to unite the people and land of China. But the hearts of the people should be first. When we have this million acres of land, but there are little willing people on it. IMO, it is just as goods as a bloated fart.

The day when the missles fly, China as whole in history and the country & people advancement on both sides of the Strait will never be the same again.

Use force we will have two simplified outcomes. (1) We win (2) We fail.

In scenario (1): We win the war, but lose the cause. Most optmistically, after take over TW in a US-in-iraq style war, best, we might suceed making TW more or less like HK; a puppet goverment that do not represent voter's will. But at cost of ten's of thosands of human lives and trillions of dollards forever-lost over likely over 2+ decades. Opportunity cost & money aside, worse yet, there are at least more than 50% of the people (30 some millions) in TW will remeber who drop the bombs on them and for what. We still lose the hearts. We lost, period.

I can draw a paralle on this kinda of unification. It happened before, when USSR took over some small slav countries at end of WWII. See what happen to them now.... The truth is that the history and memory, especially painful ones, will outlast any regime or party. One day, when hard-line CPP is gone, the compounded 15 millions pieces of memories will come back haunt us on this "treasure island". (That is exactly how some Ex-east europe bloc countries like Yugo, Kosovo, after USSR collaps, bursted into so many conflicts involving some of most senseless and inhuman revenges & killings in modern history.) These kinda memories can be repressed for many many years, but never forgotten. So in summary, over the long term, "war == lost heart == lost unification cause."

In the scenario (2), which very little people are willing to think about in this group is most grave. See this line of discussion http://www.comefromchina.com/newbbs/showthread.php?s=&forumid=98&threadid=251356
 
其?你的意思就是真打???害胚?和大?的感?╋到最後?被仇恨覆慎民族主柳╋到主後失?的是我?。
其?也很有道理.....
不咿
要求攻胚?的不只是中共的高?╋而是全大?的人民。人民的眼睛是雪亮的,若是一小群人左右整篦的办展╋那我?然?站在?大群?彦
?邋╋呃真是很大的一博╋不咿若嬴了╋中??拿回全世界攘人的心(胚海的我不保酌胚?人?╋不咿?在的局?也是小部份人造出?的的劫果╋以後的事情我不敢保酌).
仇恨??有的╋不咿取?於?媒的??╋因??在情?的主??在於?播媒篦。(士兵的素冱也有一定影?)
再?╋民族仇恨若要爆办?有人在背後扇?的╋呃?我敢保酌是美?和英?(100%),然後是?盟(50%)。?在正是斤他?一???╋不咿呃也是中?在之後办展或沉?的弈折?。?史的??已???了╋以??有停?的空殓.
(呃是本人的想法)
PS ?主可否??中文?偶看得不太舒服的真:)
 
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