Be careful when you deal with a Chinese builder

[baseline]

打起来啦！！！
不过，看了看好像Buider没有违法的事，合同没签，也没交定金，Buider和你搞了2月也没收你咨询费，估计你得到的咨询，足够你自己盖房了，哈哈，你赚了。本人提醒您，不要张口闭口Chinese, 你崇洋的话，直接找洋人，估计你真碰到洋人，就没有太多的不满了，呵呵。

 

[mds]

最初由 labor 发布



算了吧，你上CFC的目的并不是什么提醒其他网友，而是想毁一下对方，因为你自己也清楚，从法律层面上来说，你并不比对方有优势。

我好奇的是，如果是正式的合同，签字之后怎么可以修改。如果有新的合同，前一个合同还是否有效。

同样的价钱，不同的设计，cost完全不同。从你现在上CFC的气急败坏和对方的退出来看，如果按你的方案进行，你赚了大便宜，而对方基本已经无利可图。

这种没赚到便宜，就上CFC毁人的事，CFC上已经不是头一次了。

“好心提醒其它网友”的学雷锋先进分子在这个论坛里确实出现很多次，不过最终都被证明了是毁坏别人名誉，破坏别人生意的恶意行为。

还有一个这样的“好心提醒其它网友”的学雷锋先进分子，被对方告上法庭，最后以这个“好心提醒其它网友”的学雷锋先进分子被法庭判罚在CFC上登公开道歉信告终。

 

[Caohaoying]

最初由 mds 发布


“好心提醒其它网友”的学雷锋先进分子在这个论坛里确实出现很多次，不过最终都被证明了是毁坏别人名誉，破坏别人生意的恶意行为。

还有一个这样的“好心提醒其它网友”的学雷锋先进分子，被对方告上法庭，最后以这个“好心提醒其它网友”的学雷锋先进分子被法庭判罚在CFC上登公开道歉信告终。

which one?

 

[mzhuang]

1. Please to remmeber we never look down Chinese. If we did, we would not asked the builder to build a house, we also never look up 洋人. We alreay had enough with some 洋人 builders.

2. There are a section in the agreement to state that the buyer's lawayer need to review the agreement and the vendor need to get finacial support before the buyer pay deposit. Because the vender didn't agree to put the condition of well and spetic system so we didn't re-sign the modified agreement during the weekend since we have to let my lawyer to review it again but lawyer does not work at weekend!

3. I am telling you the truth, not try to make up a story. Don't say "毁坏别人名誉". If you were the person like us, what did you think about this? A lot of people tell their experience here, are they 毁坏别人名誉 here?

4. If the builder wanted to stop long time ago like the email state, he would had stop a long time ago, not only in one hour. What he thinks is that he could make more money to sell this house on open market! That made him to make decision in one hour! I don't think the price would go up so much in one month. But I am still don't know if it is the reason. If it is the price problem, why didn't he discuss with us?

If any of you in the disucssion group like to let the builder build a house, go ahead. I am sure he would build a nice house for you. Hope the thing happened on us would not happen on you. Good luck!

 

[novadalhomes]

We just tell people those facts. It is our right to sell the house we built to anybody. Before signing the legal agreement, there is no obligation for both parties. Any parties can walk away. And we have already given the buyer the choice to walk away long time ago back in May. It is not one day, or one hour decision. In the other word, even we want to sell on MLS, it is our right to do it. There is nothing wrong. We have been working so hard to try to reach an agreement for two months. Unfortunately, there is no result yet and we decide to stop there. Anyway, the house will be on the market next week.

We don't want to blame anybody. This is part of our life. We hope everyone should look forward.

 

[jstar]

最初由 mzhuang 发布
The agreement was signed but it needed to add some sections that my lawyer ask to do so!

You see their ads in this web site so I don't need to specify the name. Some people don't believe Chinese builders provide good quality work. I ddid think they were wrong. However after this event I need to add one point - Chinese builders may not take law/legal agreement seriously. My lawyer told me that they should not cancel that agreement for this reason.

During these 2 months, we never asked to rdeuce any price. We just told him the budget to build the house. Then he came out the price based on our design. The price he give us was = all cost of construction + all other fees +land cost + 12% of total construction cost for his project management fee. Of course it is much higher than we planned so I redid the mortgage application for 50k more! Then late, he found out he forgot some items in the list and he gave these for free. He also said he would give us the interest for my deposit (38k). But I just told him to reduce $500 (much less than he would pay me back) in the total price as the interest. For the price he quote, a lot of thing are basic - the lowest price items like Minto provides. So at the end, we would pay a lot of money for upgrade (we planned 10K for upgrade!). We already started to shop around to buy some discount hardware to save moeny because we were told that we could shop some hardware by ourselves!

My friends told me that I was lucky. If the builder wanted to cancel the agreement after we put current house for sell, that is even worse!

It's a bit messy. Once you asked for modification to the agreement, the original agreement may or may not be in force depending on the clauses in the original agreement.

 

[jstar]

最初由 novadalhomes 发布
We don't care about the buyer mention our company name. Our company is Novadal Homes. The website is novadalhomes.com. As far as we know we are the only Chinese builder registered constructing custom home in Ottawa. Just want to tell some facts about this story.

1. We signed the purchase and sale agreement for building a custom home for the buyer on Jun 13, 2007 on condition of finance and lawyer review, expire date 5 days. After sign, the buyer start to revise the legal clauses, schedule and the price, etc. The buyer sent us email said they cannot clear the condition in time and they want to draft a new agreement. So the signed agreement become void automatically. The re-negotiation begins. Until June 24, 2007 we haven’t signed the new agreement yet. Then we decide to stop the negotiation on June 24, 2007.

2. Regarding the quality, we have shown the buyer the model home we built, and they are happy with the quality.

3. For the past 2 months, as a builder, we have provided as much detail services as we could including: show the lot and discuss the site plan, change the design per buyer’s request, provide detail pricing, introduce the buyer our standard and products, discuss the upgrades, etc.

4. No builder do not want to sell their houses to customer. The reason that we decide to stop the negotiation is that we realize that we can never satisfy this customer.

5. Our 12% management fee is way below the market rate and ONLY account on actual construction cost. There is no extra management fee charge for land, legal, loan interest, insurance, etc.

6. The standard for this custom home is much higher than builder’s house, including full brick, hardwood floor and ceramic floor through out, custom design kitchen, custom select plumbing, upgraded trim (5’’ baseboard 3’’-1/2 casing), upgrade electrical with 200A service, many pot lights, cedar screen porch, etc.

Chinese business are always difficult. Because you are Chinese, the buyer want to pushed down the price. Don't have to take the nonsense. You did the right thing. Good for you.

 

[kemtt]

最初由 jstar 发布


Chinese business are always difficult. Because you are Chinese, the buyer want to pushed down the price. Don't have to take the nonsense. You did the right thing. Good for you.

good point

Actually, this is just an average business issue, it happens everyday.

为什么不是只说事实，而非要强调对方是华人呢？楼主似乎要说，光凭事实还不一定对，对方是华人自己就基本上对了。

 

[Melody]

最初由 mzhuang 发布
I tell my story here to remind you that you should be careful when you deal with a Chinese builder.

There is a Chinese builder in Ottawa who can build custom house. After we saw the model house, we decide to let the builder build a house in rural area in their land. Although some people didn't agree on our idea to let this Chinese builder to build a house, but we believed that he could build a high quality house for us as the one that he showed us. We had spent about 2 month on designing and discussion. Finally we signed an agreement about 2 weeks ago.

Of course we went through the legal process and let my lawyer to review the agreement. My lawyer sugguested to add some sections to protect customer right if the well or septic system have problem. At the night before we should sign the modified agreement, we received an email from his real estate agent:

"I regret to inform you that after long and very hard consideration by clients they have decided to put the home for sale on the open market. They appreciate all your effort, time and patience. However unforeseen increases
In construction materials have made the previous negotiated price very hard to guarantee.".

I was so surprised to see the email since only an hour earlier, the builder called me to ask me to book an appointment with his agent to sign the agreement again. A day earlier, he said in his email that "As both you and I spend a lot of time on it, we do want to go forward and sign the agreement with you."

I wonder if anybody had the similar experience with a builder - the builder cancelled agreement after 10 days because he thought the price is too low! He even didn't discuss the price with us or call us before he cancelled the agreement. Maybe he found a buyer who could offer higher price. However the agreement with us was still valid.

He ruin his reputation in one day! How can I trust this kind of people again? We put our believe in the company by planning to investe life saving money on the house. How could they treat us in this way? We has waste 2 months on the house!

So be careful when you deal with this Chinese builder!

The agreement was signed 2 weeks ago, at least both parties will have to respect the terms and conditions set out in that agreement. How can the builder decide to revoke the contract or agreement without paying any legal penalty?

You can always amend the agreement, as long as both parties are agreed upon, but before the amended agreement is signed, the original agreement is still in effect. Unless you inform the builder in writing that the original contract or agreement is no longer valid and a new agreement is being drafted, and will be ready on specific date. If that is the case, then, I don't see the problem of builder for doing that.

My question to you is that the so called AGREEMENT which was reviewed by your lawyer, is really signed off by both you and the builder? If so, I believe your lawyer should advise you to take necessary legal action to cover your loss.

Please do not genralize all chinese builders as bad businessmen, just because of your experience. I would change the topic as " be careful when you deal with a builder" To defame fellow chinese on CFC is not a wise move, besides you are chinese too.

Good Luck.

 

[基础墙]

最初由 mzhuang 发布

because some Chinese builders may not take legal matter seriously!

知道这句话的份量吗？说得重点，harassment based on race。因为第一，楼主的帖子里面没有给出足够的证据说Chinese builders may not take legal matter(s) seriously，楼主的话不是在陈述一个事实，而是在攻击一个群体；第二，这个攻击针对的，是一个具有种族特征的群体。

既然楼主指责别人没有守法意识，希望楼主自己也能多少有点守法意识，同时希望楼主能尽早为他的措辞道歉。

 

[pickle]

楼主人才啊，呆在渥太华会不会太委屈了？

 

[过客]

?好。看?公道自在人心。一?人可能?笨?， 但公熊?不?。

 

[胡啦哈]

最初由 Caohaoying 发布


which one?

额也想知道

 

[flapjack_monkey]

不太明白:LZ最初委托NOVADAL HOMES建CUSTOM HOUSE是在两个月前,而签合同的纠纷是这几天的事,在这中间是双方商讨设计合同等事宜.现在NOVADAL HOMES提出要把该HOUSE放在OPEN MARKET来卖,是不是说该HOUSE在合同未签之前就已经开始动工并且在这短短的两个月时间里已近于完工?

 

[nova]

最初由 flapjack_monkey 发布
不太明白:LZ最初委托NOVADAL HOMES建CUSTOM HOUSE是在两个月前,而签合同的纠纷是这几天的事,在这中间是双方商讨设计合同等事宜.现在NOVADAL HOMES提出要把该HOUSE放在OPEN MARKET来卖,是不是说该HOUSE在合同未签之前就已经开始动工并且在这短短的两个月时间里已近于完工?

所有买新房子都是买建筑图纸上的房子。签约以后，builder才开工。
因此那个builder的意思是把那块地皮上要建的房子放在市场上。