- 注册
- 2004-07-25
- 消息
- 33,823
- 荣誉分数
- 375
- 声望点数
- 243
The Past of Tibet (part 1 of 3)
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBNj5iRZlbI[/media]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBNj5iRZlbI[/media]
精华 4.13集会征集旗杆和英文文章
- 主题发起人 OneChina
- 开始时间
- 注册
- 2004-07-25
- 消息
- 33,823
- 荣誉分数
- 375
- 声望点数
- 243
The Past of Tibet (part 2 of 3)
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_YS20___c4[/media]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_YS20___c4[/media]
- 注册
- 2004-07-25
- 消息
- 33,823
- 荣誉分数
- 375
- 声望点数
- 243
The Past of Tibet (part 3 of 3)
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5seTQN-czc0&feature=related[/media]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5seTQN-czc0&feature=related[/media]
- 注册
- 2004-07-25
- 消息
- 33,823
- 荣誉分数
- 375
- 声望点数
- 243
Documentary "The past of Tibet" sheds new light on Tibet
04-02-2008 17:29
Special Report: 3.14 Tibet Riots
April. 4 at BJT 17:30 - CCTV-9 broadcasts a 25-minute-long documentary "The past of Tibet" , which portrays life of Tibetan between 1951 and 1959. Welcome watching online
This is a 25-minute-long documentary portraying life of people in the autonomous region between 1951 and 1959, a period when Tibet was still under a feudal system.
"The past of Tibet" sheds new light on Tibet Stories are told in the documentary to show that old Tibet was a feudal serfdom but not a "Shangri-la".
A DVD portraying old Tibet as a feudal serfdom and not as a "Shangri-la" has been backed by scholars, including those living in the autonomous region.
"It is ridiculous for some people to depict old Tibet as 'a beautiful land', completely ignoring what existed at the time - feudal serfdom, said experts participating in a seminar held last Friday in Beijing.
They were discussing a newly released documentary Tibet in the Past, made by the Central News Documentary Film Studio.
According to the experts, the documentary depicts life as it was in the autonomous region between 1951 and 1959, a period when Tibet was still under a feudal system.
When Tibet was liberated peacefully in 1951, the "17-Article Agreement" signed between the central government and the local Tibet government stipulated that "the local government of Tibet shall carry out reform voluntarily, and, when the people demand reform, it shall be settled through consultation with the Tibetan leaders".
But some of the ruling class were unwilling to give up the social system that preserved their high lifestyles.
Tibet was, therefore, still under a feudal system until democratic reform was introduced in 1959.
According to Wang Xiaoyi, professor in Tibetan studies with the Central University for Nationalities, the society of old Tibet under a feudal system was similar to that in Europe in the Middle Ages.
The wealthy class, government officials, nobles and high ranking monks accounted for less than 5 percent of Tibet's total population but owned all the farmlands, pastures, forests, mountains and rivers, and the majority of the livestock.
04-02-2008 17:29
Special Report: 3.14 Tibet Riots
April. 4 at BJT 17:30 - CCTV-9 broadcasts a 25-minute-long documentary "The past of Tibet" , which portrays life of Tibetan between 1951 and 1959. Welcome watching online
This is a 25-minute-long documentary portraying life of people in the autonomous region between 1951 and 1959, a period when Tibet was still under a feudal system.
"The past of Tibet" sheds new light on Tibet Stories are told in the documentary to show that old Tibet was a feudal serfdom but not a "Shangri-la".
A DVD portraying old Tibet as a feudal serfdom and not as a "Shangri-la" has been backed by scholars, including those living in the autonomous region.
"It is ridiculous for some people to depict old Tibet as 'a beautiful land', completely ignoring what existed at the time - feudal serfdom, said experts participating in a seminar held last Friday in Beijing.
They were discussing a newly released documentary Tibet in the Past, made by the Central News Documentary Film Studio.
According to the experts, the documentary depicts life as it was in the autonomous region between 1951 and 1959, a period when Tibet was still under a feudal system.
When Tibet was liberated peacefully in 1951, the "17-Article Agreement" signed between the central government and the local Tibet government stipulated that "the local government of Tibet shall carry out reform voluntarily, and, when the people demand reform, it shall be settled through consultation with the Tibetan leaders".
But some of the ruling class were unwilling to give up the social system that preserved their high lifestyles.
Tibet was, therefore, still under a feudal system until democratic reform was introduced in 1959.
According to Wang Xiaoyi, professor in Tibetan studies with the Central University for Nationalities, the society of old Tibet under a feudal system was similar to that in Europe in the Middle Ages.
The wealthy class, government officials, nobles and high ranking monks accounted for less than 5 percent of Tibet's total population but owned all the farmlands, pastures, forests, mountains and rivers, and the majority of the livestock.
附件
- 注册
- 2004-07-25
- 消息
- 33,823
- 荣誉分数
- 375
- 声望点数
- 243
2
The serfs and slaves accounted for more than 95 percent of the population.
"The past of Tibet" sheds new light on Tibet They had no personal freedom, and had to depend totally on the wealthy for their livelihood or act as their slaves from generation to generation.
According to an old Tibetan saying: "What the serfs and slaves take away is only their shadow, and what they leave behind are only their footprints."
These serfs and slaves were also subjected to taxes and high interest loans, according to Dralo, an expert in Tibetan studies with the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences.
According to incomplete statistics, there were more than 200 kinds of taxes levied by the Kasha (the former local government of Tibet). Slaves had to contribute more than 50 percent or even 70 to 80 percent of their labor free to the Kasha and the wealthy, and more than 60 percent of the farmers and herdsmen were burdened with similar high-interest loans.
"But the local leadership had no intention of using the tax revenue for the benefit of the common people, that is why the infrastructure and education in old Tibet was extremely backward," Dralo said.
Dralo added that Tibetan leaders often visited foreign countries and the central part of the Chinese mainland during 1950s, but they had no intention of introducing a modern social system in Tibet and emancipating its people.
"They just wanted to preserve the existing social system," said the researcher.
The legal system adopted in Tibet was based on its hierarchical social system.
According to Lhapa Phuntsog, head of the China Tibetology Research Center, the "13-Article Code" and "16-Article Code" of old Tibet divided the people into three classes and nine ranks, enshrining social and political inequality between the different ranks.
According to the codes, a person belonging to the highest rank of the upper class was literally worth his weight in gold, while that of a person of the lowest rank of the lower class was worth only the price of a rope.
Serfs could be sold, transferred, given away, mortgaged or exchanged by their owners, who had the power over their births, deaths and marriages.
Male and female serfs were required to pay a "redemption fee" if they wished to marry, and their children were doomed to be serfs for life. Serf-owners could punish them at will. They even established their own private prisons.
The punishments included flogging, cutting off their hands or feet, gouging out their eyes, chopping off their ears or tongues, drowning them and or throwing them off cliffs, Phuntsog said.
"It was an extremely dark era, with no equality, human rights or democracy as some people have drummed up," Phuntsog said. He is now in his 70s, and is a descendant of a former slave family, and the first one in his family that received an education.
"It is necessary to tell the world what a true old Tibet was, to stop some people from further cheating on more people who have little knowledge of Tibet in the past," said Phuntsog.
Phuntsog's views are shared by Tendzin Ganpa, a colleague, who was also the son of a former slave.
Ganpa's forefathers served as slaves for centuries for the serf master Sampo, the largest estate-holder in Lhasa before 1960.
"Compared with the 1,000 houses the Sampo family owned, our whole family had no place to live as my father turned older and was dismissed by the master," Ganpa said.
The Sampo family is also featured in the DVD.
The Sampo couple had already fled to India when the Tibetan photographer Tashi Wangdul arrived at their mansion to shoot a previous documentary in the 1950s.
The housekeeper at the time permitted Wangdul to take all the photos he wanted of the Sampo residence.
"There was a room full of foreign liquor, food and magazines of Hollywood stars. And clothes were made of various kinds of animal fur," recalled Wangdul in the new DVD.
"Given the comparisons between the haves and have-nots, how could anyone describe Tibet as a Shangri-la with democracy and equality," Ganpa said.
"Millions of the former slaves today won't deny the progress made in the new Tibet."
However, experts warned against the tendency of gradually forgetting what had happened in the old Tibet, with the passing of the elderly and historical records vanishing.
According to Tendzin Lhungrub, also a researcher with the China Tibetology Research Center, he conducted a survey in six years ago in Lhasa among 700 local students on the region's past history, and the results were disappointing. Few knew of the early events.
"Drastic measures must be taken to teach our children about the region's history," Lhungrub said.
He said he studied for his PhD dissertation on the changes that took place to a village close to the Potala Palace, which he believed would best mirror the dramatic changes Tibet has gone through in the past 50 years.
Hundreds of people used to live in the village serving the monks in the palace, which stood as a symbol of the supreme power of religion and politics in Tibet.
Now the residents there and their offspring have all been relocated and have been given better homes.
"The change has happened everywhere," Lhungrub said. "People are living totally different, but happy lives today in a new society."
Lhungrub listed that regional ethnic autonomy has ensured equality, unity, mutual help and common prosperity among all ethnic groups in the region.
Economic development, opening up and reform has transformed the once remote region into a relatively modern one with transport links to the rest of the world.
Tibetan Buddhism has remained the main religion and its monasteries well maintained. It is increasingly attracting more tourists from home and abroad.
The serfs and slaves accounted for more than 95 percent of the population.
"The past of Tibet" sheds new light on Tibet They had no personal freedom, and had to depend totally on the wealthy for their livelihood or act as their slaves from generation to generation.
According to an old Tibetan saying: "What the serfs and slaves take away is only their shadow, and what they leave behind are only their footprints."
These serfs and slaves were also subjected to taxes and high interest loans, according to Dralo, an expert in Tibetan studies with the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences.
According to incomplete statistics, there were more than 200 kinds of taxes levied by the Kasha (the former local government of Tibet). Slaves had to contribute more than 50 percent or even 70 to 80 percent of their labor free to the Kasha and the wealthy, and more than 60 percent of the farmers and herdsmen were burdened with similar high-interest loans.
"But the local leadership had no intention of using the tax revenue for the benefit of the common people, that is why the infrastructure and education in old Tibet was extremely backward," Dralo said.
Dralo added that Tibetan leaders often visited foreign countries and the central part of the Chinese mainland during 1950s, but they had no intention of introducing a modern social system in Tibet and emancipating its people.
"They just wanted to preserve the existing social system," said the researcher.
The legal system adopted in Tibet was based on its hierarchical social system.
According to Lhapa Phuntsog, head of the China Tibetology Research Center, the "13-Article Code" and "16-Article Code" of old Tibet divided the people into three classes and nine ranks, enshrining social and political inequality between the different ranks.
According to the codes, a person belonging to the highest rank of the upper class was literally worth his weight in gold, while that of a person of the lowest rank of the lower class was worth only the price of a rope.
Serfs could be sold, transferred, given away, mortgaged or exchanged by their owners, who had the power over their births, deaths and marriages.
Male and female serfs were required to pay a "redemption fee" if they wished to marry, and their children were doomed to be serfs for life. Serf-owners could punish them at will. They even established their own private prisons.
The punishments included flogging, cutting off their hands or feet, gouging out their eyes, chopping off their ears or tongues, drowning them and or throwing them off cliffs, Phuntsog said.
"It was an extremely dark era, with no equality, human rights or democracy as some people have drummed up," Phuntsog said. He is now in his 70s, and is a descendant of a former slave family, and the first one in his family that received an education.
"It is necessary to tell the world what a true old Tibet was, to stop some people from further cheating on more people who have little knowledge of Tibet in the past," said Phuntsog.
Phuntsog's views are shared by Tendzin Ganpa, a colleague, who was also the son of a former slave.
Ganpa's forefathers served as slaves for centuries for the serf master Sampo, the largest estate-holder in Lhasa before 1960.
"Compared with the 1,000 houses the Sampo family owned, our whole family had no place to live as my father turned older and was dismissed by the master," Ganpa said.
The Sampo family is also featured in the DVD.
The Sampo couple had already fled to India when the Tibetan photographer Tashi Wangdul arrived at their mansion to shoot a previous documentary in the 1950s.
The housekeeper at the time permitted Wangdul to take all the photos he wanted of the Sampo residence.
"There was a room full of foreign liquor, food and magazines of Hollywood stars. And clothes were made of various kinds of animal fur," recalled Wangdul in the new DVD.
"Given the comparisons between the haves and have-nots, how could anyone describe Tibet as a Shangri-la with democracy and equality," Ganpa said.
"Millions of the former slaves today won't deny the progress made in the new Tibet."
However, experts warned against the tendency of gradually forgetting what had happened in the old Tibet, with the passing of the elderly and historical records vanishing.
According to Tendzin Lhungrub, also a researcher with the China Tibetology Research Center, he conducted a survey in six years ago in Lhasa among 700 local students on the region's past history, and the results were disappointing. Few knew of the early events.
"Drastic measures must be taken to teach our children about the region's history," Lhungrub said.
He said he studied for his PhD dissertation on the changes that took place to a village close to the Potala Palace, which he believed would best mirror the dramatic changes Tibet has gone through in the past 50 years.
Hundreds of people used to live in the village serving the monks in the palace, which stood as a symbol of the supreme power of religion and politics in Tibet.
Now the residents there and their offspring have all been relocated and have been given better homes.
"The change has happened everywhere," Lhungrub said. "People are living totally different, but happy lives today in a new society."
Lhungrub listed that regional ethnic autonomy has ensured equality, unity, mutual help and common prosperity among all ethnic groups in the region.
Economic development, opening up and reform has transformed the once remote region into a relatively modern one with transport links to the rest of the world.
Tibetan Buddhism has remained the main religion and its monasteries well maintained. It is increasingly attracting more tourists from home and abroad.
附件
western
新手上路
- 注册
- 2004-12-13
- 消息
- 329
- 荣誉分数
- 1
- 声望点数
- 0
关于三地齐聚OTTAW 的一点小建议 (zt)
Chibet
最近特意看了很多这边关于近期时间的西人论坛和相关新闻媒体网站刊载有关新闻的下面本地西人的发言,跟贴等, 我们感觉可能大家再去PARADE时不妨考虑一下调整一下思维模式,不仅仅从我们自己的感情,感觉或说想法出发,可能要多从这边普通百姓看这些问题的角度出发,去想游行的相关口号或者标语等,相对更有效果,毕竟我们游行不仅仅是想发泄一下情绪吧?
从目前看到的本地西人论坛的情况看,这里普通百姓很多的思维跟我们的相去实际甚远, 我们有一种感觉就是如果还打那些标语,完全从我们主观出发的标语,可能对这边西人触动不会象我们想象的那么大.
简单举几个例子,象前边有朋友提议, No Politics on Olympic! 这的确可能是咱们大家伙的心声,但看本地论坛里很多西人并不是这样看的,比如很多的看法是,从开始奥运就不该在这样一个国家举办,因为"人权记录不良"(这也比较符合西方社会的价值观,信誉第一,没有CREDIT或者CREDIT不好的,做什么都难)等原因,我们可以暂时抛开＂人权记录不良＂这一本身就有失偏颇的论调不谈，但可能要考虑到一个事实就是，这可能的确是很多西方民众心目中对中国的印象，所以我们如果只从自己单方面的良好希望愿望出发去做一些类似口号标语,看上去可能很美,也能引起我们自己人的共鸣(大家应该想到这个共鸣应该不是我们游行的目的,我们不能仅仅停留在表达我们心声这个程度上?),但可能对西方普通老百姓来说,效果未必好. 建议不妨考虑一下从他们的角度, 比如把标语等还是定位在"您去过西藏吗""您了解的西藏或是中国是您亲身经历还是您仅仅从媒体听到的呢" "您有兴趣了解西藏的历史吗,您可以联系我们" "您希望中国更民主还是希望中国倒退呢,如果是前者,您可以帮助我们,我们愿意接受帮助,但请您先了解真实的中国,真实的西藏,我们就在你们中间,欢迎您随时与我们联系交流" "中国在过去二十年各方面都在进步,您知道吗" "中国不完美,但我们可以告诉您中国正在正确的轨道上,不信你可以问问您身边的每一个中国人,如果您没去过中国的话" "抵制奥运不是在帮助中国,更不是在帮助您自己" 等等.
建议组织者可以尽快去本地西人论坛,或者比如象CTV新闻报道后面一般都有本地人的跟贴评论,都是普通老百姓,可以针对性地对游行进行一些准备,我们感觉可能效果好一些,咱们孙子兵法不是说"知己知彼" 嘛,我们对自己的祖国,西藏应该是有很多了解,可能是时候看看本地人他们是怎么看的了, 看看怎样可以寻找共同点,达成共识, 让他们真正知道,了解真实的中国和西藏,无论历史还是现在, 可能比单纯地去宣传我们的愤怒,主张,或者仅从我们角度去制作标语,口号要有效果一些,毕竟我们应该也希望西方老百姓真正有机会了解咱们中国不是, 奥运这个千年等一回的大事其中不是也蕴涵了这样的元素吗?
另外就是,针对西方和藏独一直喊的口号, "FREE TIBET" , 我们是否可以针对性地做一些标语,不妨幽默一些, 比如WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY "FREE TIBET"??? TIBET HAS ALWAYS BEEN FREE SINCE 1949!!! AND WILL ALWAYS BE FREE AS PART OF CHINA !!!(写这个时间1949, 是因为注意到很多西方人总是回贴提到1949 中国人入侵西藏) 这样写,实际也是从另一个角度告诉大家, 1949年前不是FREE的,为什么呢, 因为 "大赖喇嘛" (如果要写中文不妨也把达赖喇嘛写成"大赖喇嘛", 他实际就是个大赖皮嘛)在那里里当奴隶主嘛. 所以也不妨把这个标语旁边再安排几个标语,进行解释, 比如"WE CAN TELL YOU WHY TIBET IS NOT FREE B4 1949?" "BECAUSE DALAI LAMA WAS THE MASTER AND THE REST TIBETAN WERE SLAVES" "IF YOU REALLY LOVE AND SUPPORT TIBET, CONTACT US FOR MORE INFO WE CAN TELL YOU MORE"然后旁边不妨放一些当年奴隶制度下西藏人民的生活图片或者标语和今天西藏人民生活图片的对比，基本意思就是列举事实,可能比空喊口号要有效果些 ,还有就是不妨去查一些数据, 列举对西藏等少数民族地区,他们相对汉族有哪些优惠政策, 比如"TIBETAN HAS MANY PRIVILEGES AS MINORITY ETHNIC GROUP IN CHINA" "TIBAETAN CAN HAVE SECOND OR MORE CHILD WHILE "HAN" CAN NOT" 等等, 这些都是事实,也是对少数民族政策倾斜的事实, 可能列决这些简单的事实更能让西方人怀疑藏独分子喊所谓"FREE TIBET"到底是要干什么, 连汉族都没有的特权他们都有,还要如何,类似的倾斜政策越多越好,可以集中写标语,也可以写在一个标语牌上.
总之,以上部分都是抛砖引玉, 主要还是基于前面看本地人的发贴,得出的感觉, 可能让事实说话比较好, 这实际也是我们对本地媒体不满的原因啊, 他们本地媒体不说事实,甚至歪曲事实,而我们再不说事实, 那本地西人老百姓就更没法知道了,光看我们喊的表达情绪或愤怒的口号,可能触动不了他们.
写得有点乱,想到哪里写到哪,这里简单总结一下我们的的感觉就是, 对这次去OTTAWA游行集会,可能可以考虑几个着重点,
一 呼吁本地人去了解中国,了解西藏, 历史和现实,
二表达我们的心意,他们愿意了解,可以联系我们,我们愿意介绍和说明我们知道的中国,我们知道的西藏,我们都是普通老百姓,没有官方背景
三列举西藏历史和现实的图片和数据及作为少数民族他们拥有的特权和政策倾斜
四关于奥运,可能可以考虑按上面建议的方式, 不必过多强调什么"不要把政治牵扯进来"等等,西方民众实际对奥运精神应该不比我们了解得浅, 毕竟他们是发源地. 况且我们都知道也坚信,奥运在北京举行,是铁定的, 绝不会因为几个小跳蚤蹦达一下就不办或者不在北京办了,至于哪个国家领导人,爱去不去,注意到到目前表示不去的也小心翼翼地表示那只是出于他自己的"Personal Opinion"，并不代表他那个国家的人民大众或运动员,而这些人才应该是奥运真正的主角,那些说不去开幕式的政客嘛,反正也是配角,咱们中国人又历来有容乃大,这点个人自由就批准了,不跟他计较
.
基于上面的想法,在做标语上,可能我们换个角度, 比如多打一些表示我们欢迎西方普通大众去中国看奥运的标语,表示我们的热情和我们对他们希望了解中国,支持帮助中国,支持中国奥运的感谢或者是对他们的一些建议,比如 "THE BEST WAY TO KNOW A REAL CHINA, COME TO BEIJING OLYMPIC 2008" "USE YOUR OWN EYES TO SEE A REAL BEIJING , A REAL TIBET","COME TO BEIJING, CHEER THE TIBETAN ATHLETE ON SITE IF YOU REALLY SUPPORT TIBET" (查了一下,奥运中国选手里有藏族同胞,例如次仁吉,赛艇选手,如果可能再找些其他的选手更佳,可以考虑做一些他们的图片,下面写上 TIBETAN ATHLETE IN BEIJING ２００８OLYMPIC,写上他们的名字,把这种标语做大些,这种标语应该比较有说服力)等等, 既是我们实实在在地在支持北京奥运,同时也是对化解受本地歪曲媒体影响的,受分裂分子影响的西人老百姓对奥运的抵触的比较好的方式,对我们的游行,集会的效果可能反而更好些. 说到底, 老百姓其实应该是好沟通的,我们可能要多走一步,就是多从他们的角度,去主动搭建沟通,理解的桥梁,毕竟他们的政府还是由他们老百姓一票一票选出来的, 这样转换个角度去游行和集会,可能会好些?
另外就是我们感觉,如果遇到藏独分子,大家一定不要动手,否则虽然可能解气,但未免授人以柄, 再给当地媒体歪曲一下,大家努力可能都白费了, 不值得,还脏了手(听说藏独分子们一月洗一次澡的习惯终生不变
) 组织者不妨去之前考虑好如果他们出现的应对措施,比如大家保持一致,始终把他们排挤在人群外沿,甚至分割他们的队伍,分得越小越好等,当然这也要看咱们去的人和他们出现的人数量对比, 不过既然是三个城市,想必不会输的
也不必对他们进行过激的言辞交锋,比如问他们拿了多少钱来游行等,意义不大,不必把我们放到跟他们一样的水平上去, 我们做我们的事情,有意识地分割分化他们的力量,让他们自生自灭好了,但如果他们首先出现过激行为(谅他们也不敢,但以防万一), 一定要注意记录证据(手机,相机,视频的更好),自卫的前提下,叫警察处理,一定别防卫过当. 道理如前所述,尽量避免授人以柄.
最后,就是一个小想法,就是做标语也好,宣传单也好,我们感觉不必太多红色,或者把红色弄得太夸张, 大家都是有血性的中国人,但可能让理智驾御一下我们的激情, 缓缓释放更容易被西方普通老百姓接受? 毕竟"红色中国"已被各种反华势力"妖魔化"太久了, 我们不妨主动冲淡一下这种印象,比如可以弄些底色为天蓝色, 淡绿色等标语或宣传单,让西方人看看, 我们并不嗜血,我们也爱蓝天，爱白云, 爱绿地,爱和平. 而祖国色---红色, 就由国旗---我们的五星红旗来飘扬好了,你们说呢?
以上只是我们的一点感觉和建议,仅仅是想供大家参考.未必很成熟,但总是希望能出点力,有什么不合适的地方,请大家一定多多包涵. 见谅.
(希望组织者尽量考虑周全些,尤其提醒一下大家开车等注意安全,生命是最宝贵的)
最后
预祝大家游行顺利,安全,成功!!!
有时间请大家多多支持我们的网站 www.chibet.com
让我们为同一个目的,走到一起 !!!
维护祖国统一,反对暴力,反对分裂, 支持奥运-北京 !!!
Chibet
最近特意看了很多这边关于近期时间的西人论坛和相关新闻媒体网站刊载有关新闻的下面本地西人的发言,跟贴等, 我们感觉可能大家再去PARADE时不妨考虑一下调整一下思维模式,不仅仅从我们自己的感情,感觉或说想法出发,可能要多从这边普通百姓看这些问题的角度出发,去想游行的相关口号或者标语等,相对更有效果,毕竟我们游行不仅仅是想发泄一下情绪吧?
从目前看到的本地西人论坛的情况看,这里普通百姓很多的思维跟我们的相去实际甚远, 我们有一种感觉就是如果还打那些标语,完全从我们主观出发的标语,可能对这边西人触动不会象我们想象的那么大.
简单举几个例子,象前边有朋友提议, No Politics on Olympic! 这的确可能是咱们大家伙的心声,但看本地论坛里很多西人并不是这样看的,比如很多的看法是,从开始奥运就不该在这样一个国家举办,因为"人权记录不良"(这也比较符合西方社会的价值观,信誉第一,没有CREDIT或者CREDIT不好的,做什么都难)等原因,我们可以暂时抛开＂人权记录不良＂这一本身就有失偏颇的论调不谈，但可能要考虑到一个事实就是，这可能的确是很多西方民众心目中对中国的印象，所以我们如果只从自己单方面的良好希望愿望出发去做一些类似口号标语,看上去可能很美,也能引起我们自己人的共鸣(大家应该想到这个共鸣应该不是我们游行的目的,我们不能仅仅停留在表达我们心声这个程度上?),但可能对西方普通老百姓来说,效果未必好. 建议不妨考虑一下从他们的角度, 比如把标语等还是定位在"您去过西藏吗""您了解的西藏或是中国是您亲身经历还是您仅仅从媒体听到的呢" "您有兴趣了解西藏的历史吗,您可以联系我们" "您希望中国更民主还是希望中国倒退呢,如果是前者,您可以帮助我们,我们愿意接受帮助,但请您先了解真实的中国,真实的西藏,我们就在你们中间,欢迎您随时与我们联系交流" "中国在过去二十年各方面都在进步,您知道吗" "中国不完美,但我们可以告诉您中国正在正确的轨道上,不信你可以问问您身边的每一个中国人,如果您没去过中国的话" "抵制奥运不是在帮助中国,更不是在帮助您自己" 等等.
建议组织者可以尽快去本地西人论坛,或者比如象CTV新闻报道后面一般都有本地人的跟贴评论,都是普通老百姓,可以针对性地对游行进行一些准备,我们感觉可能效果好一些,咱们孙子兵法不是说"知己知彼" 嘛,我们对自己的祖国,西藏应该是有很多了解,可能是时候看看本地人他们是怎么看的了, 看看怎样可以寻找共同点,达成共识, 让他们真正知道,了解真实的中国和西藏,无论历史还是现在, 可能比单纯地去宣传我们的愤怒,主张,或者仅从我们角度去制作标语,口号要有效果一些,毕竟我们应该也希望西方老百姓真正有机会了解咱们中国不是, 奥运这个千年等一回的大事其中不是也蕴涵了这样的元素吗?
另外就是,针对西方和藏独一直喊的口号, "FREE TIBET" , 我们是否可以针对性地做一些标语,不妨幽默一些, 比如WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY "FREE TIBET"??? TIBET HAS ALWAYS BEEN FREE SINCE 1949!!! AND WILL ALWAYS BE FREE AS PART OF CHINA !!!(写这个时间1949, 是因为注意到很多西方人总是回贴提到1949 中国人入侵西藏) 这样写,实际也是从另一个角度告诉大家, 1949年前不是FREE的,为什么呢, 因为 "大赖喇嘛" (如果要写中文不妨也把达赖喇嘛写成"大赖喇嘛", 他实际就是个大赖皮嘛)在那里里当奴隶主嘛. 所以也不妨把这个标语旁边再安排几个标语,进行解释, 比如"WE CAN TELL YOU WHY TIBET IS NOT FREE B4 1949?" "BECAUSE DALAI LAMA WAS THE MASTER AND THE REST TIBETAN WERE SLAVES" "IF YOU REALLY LOVE AND SUPPORT TIBET, CONTACT US FOR MORE INFO WE CAN TELL YOU MORE"然后旁边不妨放一些当年奴隶制度下西藏人民的生活图片或者标语和今天西藏人民生活图片的对比，基本意思就是列举事实,可能比空喊口号要有效果些 ,还有就是不妨去查一些数据, 列举对西藏等少数民族地区,他们相对汉族有哪些优惠政策, 比如"TIBETAN HAS MANY PRIVILEGES AS MINORITY ETHNIC GROUP IN CHINA" "TIBAETAN CAN HAVE SECOND OR MORE CHILD WHILE "HAN" CAN NOT" 等等, 这些都是事实,也是对少数民族政策倾斜的事实, 可能列决这些简单的事实更能让西方人怀疑藏独分子喊所谓"FREE TIBET"到底是要干什么, 连汉族都没有的特权他们都有,还要如何,类似的倾斜政策越多越好,可以集中写标语,也可以写在一个标语牌上.
总之,以上部分都是抛砖引玉, 主要还是基于前面看本地人的发贴,得出的感觉, 可能让事实说话比较好, 这实际也是我们对本地媒体不满的原因啊, 他们本地媒体不说事实,甚至歪曲事实,而我们再不说事实, 那本地西人老百姓就更没法知道了,光看我们喊的表达情绪或愤怒的口号,可能触动不了他们.
写得有点乱,想到哪里写到哪,这里简单总结一下我们的的感觉就是, 对这次去OTTAWA游行集会,可能可以考虑几个着重点,
一 呼吁本地人去了解中国,了解西藏, 历史和现实,
二表达我们的心意,他们愿意了解,可以联系我们,我们愿意介绍和说明我们知道的中国,我们知道的西藏,我们都是普通老百姓,没有官方背景
三列举西藏历史和现实的图片和数据及作为少数民族他们拥有的特权和政策倾斜
四关于奥运,可能可以考虑按上面建议的方式, 不必过多强调什么"不要把政治牵扯进来"等等,西方民众实际对奥运精神应该不比我们了解得浅, 毕竟他们是发源地. 况且我们都知道也坚信,奥运在北京举行,是铁定的, 绝不会因为几个小跳蚤蹦达一下就不办或者不在北京办了,至于哪个国家领导人,爱去不去,注意到到目前表示不去的也小心翼翼地表示那只是出于他自己的"Personal Opinion"，并不代表他那个国家的人民大众或运动员,而这些人才应该是奥运真正的主角,那些说不去开幕式的政客嘛,反正也是配角,咱们中国人又历来有容乃大,这点个人自由就批准了,不跟他计较
基于上面的想法,在做标语上,可能我们换个角度, 比如多打一些表示我们欢迎西方普通大众去中国看奥运的标语,表示我们的热情和我们对他们希望了解中国,支持帮助中国,支持中国奥运的感谢或者是对他们的一些建议,比如 "THE BEST WAY TO KNOW A REAL CHINA, COME TO BEIJING OLYMPIC 2008" "USE YOUR OWN EYES TO SEE A REAL BEIJING , A REAL TIBET","COME TO BEIJING, CHEER THE TIBETAN ATHLETE ON SITE IF YOU REALLY SUPPORT TIBET" (查了一下,奥运中国选手里有藏族同胞,例如次仁吉,赛艇选手,如果可能再找些其他的选手更佳,可以考虑做一些他们的图片,下面写上 TIBETAN ATHLETE IN BEIJING ２００８OLYMPIC,写上他们的名字,把这种标语做大些,这种标语应该比较有说服力)等等, 既是我们实实在在地在支持北京奥运,同时也是对化解受本地歪曲媒体影响的,受分裂分子影响的西人老百姓对奥运的抵触的比较好的方式,对我们的游行,集会的效果可能反而更好些. 说到底, 老百姓其实应该是好沟通的,我们可能要多走一步,就是多从他们的角度,去主动搭建沟通,理解的桥梁,毕竟他们的政府还是由他们老百姓一票一票选出来的, 这样转换个角度去游行和集会,可能会好些?
另外就是我们感觉,如果遇到藏独分子,大家一定不要动手,否则虽然可能解气,但未免授人以柄, 再给当地媒体歪曲一下,大家努力可能都白费了, 不值得,还脏了手(听说藏独分子们一月洗一次澡的习惯终生不变
最后,就是一个小想法,就是做标语也好,宣传单也好,我们感觉不必太多红色,或者把红色弄得太夸张, 大家都是有血性的中国人,但可能让理智驾御一下我们的激情, 缓缓释放更容易被西方普通老百姓接受? 毕竟"红色中国"已被各种反华势力"妖魔化"太久了, 我们不妨主动冲淡一下这种印象,比如可以弄些底色为天蓝色, 淡绿色等标语或宣传单,让西方人看看, 我们并不嗜血,我们也爱蓝天，爱白云, 爱绿地,爱和平. 而祖国色---红色, 就由国旗---我们的五星红旗来飘扬好了,你们说呢?
以上只是我们的一点感觉和建议,仅仅是想供大家参考.未必很成熟,但总是希望能出点力,有什么不合适的地方,请大家一定多多包涵. 见谅.
(希望组织者尽量考虑周全些,尤其提醒一下大家开车等注意安全,生命是最宝贵的)
最后
预祝大家游行顺利,安全,成功!!!
有时间请大家多多支持我们的网站 www.chibet.com
让我们为同一个目的,走到一起 !!!
维护祖国统一,反对暴力,反对分裂, 支持奥运-北京 !!!
- 注册
- 2002-07-28
- 消息
- 14,150
- 荣誉分数
- 533
- 声望点数
- 273
- 注册
- 2003-04-13
- 消息
- 241,120
- 荣誉分数
- 37,889
- 声望点数
- 1,393
Washington Post上陈冲的文章：Let the Games Go On
Let the Games Go On
By Joan Chen
Wednesday, April 9, 2008; A19
I was born in Shanghai in 1961 and grew up during the Cultural Revolution. During my childhood, I saw my family lose our house. My grandfather, who studied medicine in England, committed suicide after he was wrongly accused of being a counterrevolutionary and a foreign spy.
Those were the worst of times.
Since the Cultural Revolution ended in the late 1970s, however, I have witnessed unimaginable progress in China. Changes that few ever thought possible have occurred in a single generation. A communist government that had no ties to the West has evolved into a more open government eager to join the international community.
A state-controlled economy has morphed into a market economy, greatly raising people's standard of living. It's clear that the majority of the Chinese people enjoy much fuller, more abundant lives today than 30 years ago. Though much remains to be done, the Chinese government has made rapid progress in opening up and trying to be part of the international community.
Last month I went to China and spent four weeks visiting Shanghai, Beijing, Hong Kong and Chengdu. The people I met and spoke with are proud and excited about the Beijing Games. They believe that the Olympics are a wonderful opportunity to showcase modern China to the rest of the world. Like many Americans, most Chinese people are disturbed by the recent events in Tibet. But after watching the scenes of violence and arson by the rioters, the Chinese believe that the government is doing the right thing in cracking down to restore order.
The Olympic torch is in California and is to be carried through San Francisco today. In a resolution criticizing China, Chris Daly, a member of the San Francisco Board of Supervisors, said that demonstrating against the torch relay would "provide the people of San Francisco with a lifetime opportunity to help 1.3 billion Chinese people gain more freedom and rights." To his credit, Mayor Gavin Newsom did not sign Daly's resolution.
This statement could not be further from reality. For one thing, the Chinese are a proud people. They want freedom and greater rights, but they know they must fight for them from within. They know that no one can grant them freedom and rights from afar. The stigma of Western imperialism and the Opium Wars also remains a strong reminder of the past, and Chinese people do not want their domestic policies to be dictated by outside powers. They also do not want the United States to boycott the opening ceremonies of the Games. The U.S. boycott of the 1980 Games in Moscow and the Soviet boycott of the 1984 Olympics in Los Angeles accomplished nothing. A U.S. boycott of the opening ceremonies in Beijing would be counterproductive for relations between the two countries.
For decades, anti-China human rights groups in Washington have spent millions of dollars denouncing China. To many Chinese, it seems that this lobby is the only voice that's acceptable or newsworthy in the U.S. media and to the U.S. government. But times are changing. We need to be open-minded and farsighted. We need to make more friends than enemies. Remember what a little ping-pong game did for Sino-U.S. relations in the 1970s? Let's celebrate the Olympics for what the Games are meant to be -- a bridge for friendship, not a playground for politics.
The writer is an actress and director. She became a U.S. citizen in 1989.
Let the Games Go On
By Joan Chen
Wednesday, April 9, 2008; A19
I was born in Shanghai in 1961 and grew up during the Cultural Revolution. During my childhood, I saw my family lose our house. My grandfather, who studied medicine in England, committed suicide after he was wrongly accused of being a counterrevolutionary and a foreign spy.
Those were the worst of times.
Since the Cultural Revolution ended in the late 1970s, however, I have witnessed unimaginable progress in China. Changes that few ever thought possible have occurred in a single generation. A communist government that had no ties to the West has evolved into a more open government eager to join the international community.
A state-controlled economy has morphed into a market economy, greatly raising people's standard of living. It's clear that the majority of the Chinese people enjoy much fuller, more abundant lives today than 30 years ago. Though much remains to be done, the Chinese government has made rapid progress in opening up and trying to be part of the international community.
Last month I went to China and spent four weeks visiting Shanghai, Beijing, Hong Kong and Chengdu. The people I met and spoke with are proud and excited about the Beijing Games. They believe that the Olympics are a wonderful opportunity to showcase modern China to the rest of the world. Like many Americans, most Chinese people are disturbed by the recent events in Tibet. But after watching the scenes of violence and arson by the rioters, the Chinese believe that the government is doing the right thing in cracking down to restore order.
The Olympic torch is in California and is to be carried through San Francisco today. In a resolution criticizing China, Chris Daly, a member of the San Francisco Board of Supervisors, said that demonstrating against the torch relay would "provide the people of San Francisco with a lifetime opportunity to help 1.3 billion Chinese people gain more freedom and rights." To his credit, Mayor Gavin Newsom did not sign Daly's resolution.
This statement could not be further from reality. For one thing, the Chinese are a proud people. They want freedom and greater rights, but they know they must fight for them from within. They know that no one can grant them freedom and rights from afar. The stigma of Western imperialism and the Opium Wars also remains a strong reminder of the past, and Chinese people do not want their domestic policies to be dictated by outside powers. They also do not want the United States to boycott the opening ceremonies of the Games. The U.S. boycott of the 1980 Games in Moscow and the Soviet boycott of the 1984 Olympics in Los Angeles accomplished nothing. A U.S. boycott of the opening ceremonies in Beijing would be counterproductive for relations between the two countries.
For decades, anti-China human rights groups in Washington have spent millions of dollars denouncing China. To many Chinese, it seems that this lobby is the only voice that's acceptable or newsworthy in the U.S. media and to the U.S. government. But times are changing. We need to be open-minded and farsighted. We need to make more friends than enemies. Remember what a little ping-pong game did for Sino-U.S. relations in the 1970s? Let's celebrate the Olympics for what the Games are meant to be -- a bridge for friendship, not a playground for politics.
The writer is an actress and director. She became a U.S. citizen in 1989.
英文文章
International Olympic Committee President Jacques Rogge:
"We recognize the right for people to protest and express their views, but it should be nonviolent. We are very sad for all the athletes and the people who expected so much from the run and have been spoiled of their joy"
Richard Pound, Canada's senior member on the IOC:
"They're complaining about the violence in Tibet, but they [protesters] are using violent means to get to the innocent runners who are carrying an international symbol of peace. When protest turns into hooliganism, they can't claim to have any moral high ground."
Maureen Fiori, Ottawa (Citizen April 9, 2008):
The disruption of the relay cannot be justified by what is often cited as "Chinese crackdown in Tibet" in which the Chinese authorities strove to prevent more of the damage by the Tibetan mobs that had already caused extensive property damage and the deaths of several Chinese citizens including five girls burned in a fire.
The March 19 Economist article. Below are some contents of that article (Economist.com).
The Economist , March 19, 2008:
"Our Beijing correspondent happened to be in Lhasa as the riots broke out. Here is what he saw."
"A crowd of several dozen people rampaged along the road, some of them whooping as they threw stones at shops owned by ethnic Han Chinese"
"Crowds formed, seemingly spontaneously, in numerous parts of the district. They smashed into non-Tibetan shops, pulled merchandise onto the streets, piled it up and set fire to it. Everything from sides of yak meat to items of laundry was thrown onto the pyres. Rioters delighted in tossing in cooking-gas canisters and running for cover as they exploded."
"the many Hans who live above their shops in the Tibetan quarter were quick to flee. Had they not, there might have been more casualties. (The government, plausibly, says 13 people were killed by rioters, mostly in fires.) Some of those who remained, in flats above their shops, kept the lights off to avoid detection and spoke in hushed tones lest their Mandarin dialect be heard on the streets by Tibetans. One Han teenager ran into a monastery for refuge, prostrating himself before a red-robed Tibetan abbot who agreed to give him shelter."
"The destruction was systematic. Shops owned by Tibetans were marked as such with traditional white scarves tied through their shutter-handles. They were spared destruction. Almost every other one was wrecked."
"Han Chinese in Lhasa were baffled and enraged by the slow reaction of the security forces. Thousands of people probably lost most, if not all, of their livelihoods (the majority of Lhasa's small businesses have no insurance, let alone against rioting)."
"The rioting on March 14th and 15th involved mainly ordinary citizens, but monks are often at the forefront of separatist unrest in Tibet."
"A surge of government spending on infrastructure in recent years and strong growth in Tibet's tourism industry (made easier by the new infrastructure, especially the rail link, which was opened in 2006) have helped the region's GDP growth rate stay above 12% for the past seven years. In 2007 it was 14%, more than two points higher than the national rate."
"Between 2002 and July last year [2007] Chinese officials held six rounds of talks with the Dalai Lama's representatives. Laurence Brahm, an American author who has tried to mediate, says the discussions reached a high point in 2005 when the Chinese appeared to recognise that the Dalai Lama was crucial to resolving Tibet's tensions. At one stage the Chinese even considered allowing the Dalai Lama to visit Wutai Mountain in Shanxi province as a confidence-building measure, but they got cold feet."
International Olympic Committee President Jacques Rogge:
"We recognize the right for people to protest and express their views, but it should be nonviolent. We are very sad for all the athletes and the people who expected so much from the run and have been spoiled of their joy"
Richard Pound, Canada's senior member on the IOC:
"They're complaining about the violence in Tibet, but they [protesters] are using violent means to get to the innocent runners who are carrying an international symbol of peace. When protest turns into hooliganism, they can't claim to have any moral high ground."
Maureen Fiori, Ottawa (Citizen April 9, 2008):
The disruption of the relay cannot be justified by what is often cited as "Chinese crackdown in Tibet" in which the Chinese authorities strove to prevent more of the damage by the Tibetan mobs that had already caused extensive property damage and the deaths of several Chinese citizens including five girls burned in a fire.
The March 19 Economist article. Below are some contents of that article (Economist.com).
The Economist , March 19, 2008:
"Our Beijing correspondent happened to be in Lhasa as the riots broke out. Here is what he saw."
"A crowd of several dozen people rampaged along the road, some of them whooping as they threw stones at shops owned by ethnic Han Chinese"
"Crowds formed, seemingly spontaneously, in numerous parts of the district. They smashed into non-Tibetan shops, pulled merchandise onto the streets, piled it up and set fire to it. Everything from sides of yak meat to items of laundry was thrown onto the pyres. Rioters delighted in tossing in cooking-gas canisters and running for cover as they exploded."
"the many Hans who live above their shops in the Tibetan quarter were quick to flee. Had they not, there might have been more casualties. (The government, plausibly, says 13 people were killed by rioters, mostly in fires.) Some of those who remained, in flats above their shops, kept the lights off to avoid detection and spoke in hushed tones lest their Mandarin dialect be heard on the streets by Tibetans. One Han teenager ran into a monastery for refuge, prostrating himself before a red-robed Tibetan abbot who agreed to give him shelter."
"The destruction was systematic. Shops owned by Tibetans were marked as such with traditional white scarves tied through their shutter-handles. They were spared destruction. Almost every other one was wrecked."
"Han Chinese in Lhasa were baffled and enraged by the slow reaction of the security forces. Thousands of people probably lost most, if not all, of their livelihoods (the majority of Lhasa's small businesses have no insurance, let alone against rioting)."
"The rioting on March 14th and 15th involved mainly ordinary citizens, but monks are often at the forefront of separatist unrest in Tibet."
"A surge of government spending on infrastructure in recent years and strong growth in Tibet's tourism industry (made easier by the new infrastructure, especially the rail link, which was opened in 2006) have helped the region's GDP growth rate stay above 12% for the past seven years. In 2007 it was 14%, more than two points higher than the national rate."
"Between 2002 and July last year [2007] Chinese officials held six rounds of talks with the Dalai Lama's representatives. Laurence Brahm, an American author who has tried to mediate, says the discussions reached a high point in 2005 when the Chinese appeared to recognise that the Dalai Lama was crucial to resolving Tibet's tensions. At one stage the Chinese even considered allowing the Dalai Lama to visit Wutai Mountain in Shanxi province as a confidence-building measure, but they got cold feet."
