google 撤出中国， 对谁有好处？
- 主题发起人 viper99
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村长，您来资本主义国家年头不少了
资本家钱再多，会嫌多吗？
赚钱是有瘾的，钱对有钱人来说，后来就是数字，有成就感的
赚到最后，象比尔一样，全捐掉，那叫酷
嘿。
其实，我感觉谷哥儿开始是有个“政治日程”的。但是，谷哥儿基本估计错误，搞政治赌博玩输了，最后只好这样给自己个台阶下而已。谷哥儿是做梦也没有预料到自己会落到今天这个“偷鸡不成失把米”的地步。
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看大家对谷歌这么有兴趣，来一些Q&A
Q&A: An explanation of Google's moves in China
Now that Google is sending Web surfers in mainland China to a Hong Kong-based site, the company is free to display complete search results on any topic without the self-censorship Beijing had required. But that doesn't mean people in China are getting more information.
By Jessica Mintz
AP Technology Writer
SEATTLE —
Now that Google is sending Web surfers in mainland China to a Hong Kong-based site, the company is free to display complete search results on any topic without the self-censorship Beijing had required. But that doesn't mean people in China are getting more information.
The Chinese government's own Web filtering tools are blocking people from seeing the results of sensitive searches made on the Hong Kong site, Google.com.hk. And if it wants to, Beijing could keep people on the mainland from even connecting to the Hong Kong site.
Some questions and answers about the situation:
Q: What was Google.cn? Why would someone in China use that instead of Google.com?
A: Google operates a Chinese-language search site that people from all over the world can access. But starting in 2002, Google learned that when Web users in China typed in words deemed sensitive by Beijing, such as "the '89 student movement," referring to the Tiananmen Square massacre, the requests for information didn't always reach Google's servers because of blocking by the Chinese government. The users' Web browsers would stop working or show an error message. Sometimes Google.com was slow or completely unavailable to mainland Chinese users. Or people were even redirected to a competing search site.
The company launched Google.cn, using the Internet domain for China, in 2006 so people in China would have a faster and more reliable site. To be allowed to offer the service, Google had to agree to abide by Beijing's mandate that information deemed subversive or pornographic be omitted. But Google could tell people when it was excluding results.
Q: Why is an open Internet allowed in Hong Kong but not on the mainland?
A: Hong Kong, a former British colony, was granted a degree of autonomy when it returned to Chinese rule 13 years ago. The legal and political freedoms that Hong Kong citizens had under British rule were largely preserved through the transition and are set to remain in place for 37 more years.
Q: Can China take away Google.cn and stop visitors from being sent anywhere else?
A: Yes. The China Internet Network Information Center, which answers to China's Ministry of Information Industry, controls the master "directory" of ".cn" Web sites. It could erase "google.cn" from its domain name registry, which means people hunting for the search engine would be told "site not found." The government also could change what happens when someone types "google.cn" into a Web browser. Instead of ending up at google.com.hk, Chinese Web surfers might end up at a competing Chinese site that still censors results.
Q: Beyond getting service providers such as Google to censor their services in the mainland, how else does China control Internet content?
A: Through filters in Internet cafes, at Internet service provider companies and at the entryways of the main intersections on the network that connect China to the rest of the world. At any point, a sensitive search could get trapped in one of those filters. The person who typed in the search might get an error page and might have problems accessing Google or other sites for some period after, even for non-sensitive searches.
Some savvy users can get around the filters. Various "proxy" servers have been set up by human-rights activists and other volunteers to fool the government into thinking a citizen is reaching an innocuous site. That proxy, in turn, grabs and returns information that might otherwise be censored. The government tries to block these proxy servers as it learns of them, but new ones quickly pop up.
Q: Does China control ".hk" domains as well?
A: No. Those are managed by Hong Kong Internet Registration Corp., a nonprofit organization that operates independently of the government. So while China can block its mainland citizens from viewing Hong Kong Web sites, including those run by Google, it can't go into Hong Kong and shut them down.
Q&A: An explanation of Google's moves in China
Now that Google is sending Web surfers in mainland China to a Hong Kong-based site, the company is free to display complete search results on any topic without the self-censorship Beijing had required. But that doesn't mean people in China are getting more information.
By Jessica Mintz
AP Technology Writer
SEATTLE —
Now that Google is sending Web surfers in mainland China to a Hong Kong-based site, the company is free to display complete search results on any topic without the self-censorship Beijing had required. But that doesn't mean people in China are getting more information.
The Chinese government's own Web filtering tools are blocking people from seeing the results of sensitive searches made on the Hong Kong site, Google.com.hk. And if it wants to, Beijing could keep people on the mainland from even connecting to the Hong Kong site.
Some questions and answers about the situation:
Q: What was Google.cn? Why would someone in China use that instead of Google.com?
A: Google operates a Chinese-language search site that people from all over the world can access. But starting in 2002, Google learned that when Web users in China typed in words deemed sensitive by Beijing, such as "the '89 student movement," referring to the Tiananmen Square massacre, the requests for information didn't always reach Google's servers because of blocking by the Chinese government. The users' Web browsers would stop working or show an error message. Sometimes Google.com was slow or completely unavailable to mainland Chinese users. Or people were even redirected to a competing search site.
The company launched Google.cn, using the Internet domain for China, in 2006 so people in China would have a faster and more reliable site. To be allowed to offer the service, Google had to agree to abide by Beijing's mandate that information deemed subversive or pornographic be omitted. But Google could tell people when it was excluding results.
Q: Why is an open Internet allowed in Hong Kong but not on the mainland?
A: Hong Kong, a former British colony, was granted a degree of autonomy when it returned to Chinese rule 13 years ago. The legal and political freedoms that Hong Kong citizens had under British rule were largely preserved through the transition and are set to remain in place for 37 more years.
Q: Can China take away Google.cn and stop visitors from being sent anywhere else?
A: Yes. The China Internet Network Information Center, which answers to China's Ministry of Information Industry, controls the master "directory" of ".cn" Web sites. It could erase "google.cn" from its domain name registry, which means people hunting for the search engine would be told "site not found." The government also could change what happens when someone types "google.cn" into a Web browser. Instead of ending up at google.com.hk, Chinese Web surfers might end up at a competing Chinese site that still censors results.
Q: Beyond getting service providers such as Google to censor their services in the mainland, how else does China control Internet content?
A: Through filters in Internet cafes, at Internet service provider companies and at the entryways of the main intersections on the network that connect China to the rest of the world. At any point, a sensitive search could get trapped in one of those filters. The person who typed in the search might get an error page and might have problems accessing Google or other sites for some period after, even for non-sensitive searches.
Some savvy users can get around the filters. Various "proxy" servers have been set up by human-rights activists and other volunteers to fool the government into thinking a citizen is reaching an innocuous site. That proxy, in turn, grabs and returns information that might otherwise be censored. The government tries to block these proxy servers as it learns of them, but new ones quickly pop up.
Q: Does China control ".hk" domains as well?
A: No. Those are managed by Hong Kong Internet Registration Corp., a nonprofit organization that operates independently of the government. So while China can block its mainland citizens from viewing Hong Kong Web sites, including those run by Google, it can't go into Hong Kong and shut them down.
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Google gives China food for thought
China, meanwhile, angrily attacked Google for stopping censorship of its Chinese-language search engine but said there should be no broader fallout in Sino-US ties provided there was no political meddling in the US.
US State Department spokesman Philip Crowley said the US respects but was "not party" to Google's decision to redirect search queries from mainland China to an uncensored site in Hong Kong.
While Washington stands for internet freedom, "individual businesses will make judgments as to the investment opportunity in China," he told reporters.
"We value the economic relationship between the US and China," Mr Crowley said, citing massive increases in trade over nearly three decades.
"That said, were I China, I would seriously consider the implications when one of the most recognizable institutions has decided that it's too difficult to do business in China," he said.
"And that has implications, but that ultimately is for China to evaluate," the State Department spokesman said.
In Beijing, officials reserved their ire for Google, which lifted censorship of its Chinese search engine, Google.cn, in response to cyberattacks last year which the company said targeted email accounts of Chinese rights activists.
"I don't see it influencing Sino-US relations unless some people want to politicise it," Chinese foreign ministry spokesman Qin Gang told reporters, describing the Google situation as "mainly an individual commercial case."
"If you link this to China-US relations or politicize it, or even link it to China's international image, this is mere overkill," Mr Qin said, adding: "China's market is fully open."
Google said it was "business as usual" at its China headquarters on Tuesday, as a fierce debate erupted online between Chinese defenders of free speech and nationalist-minded net users denouncing foreign interference.
Google spokeswoman Marsha Wang said she had no information about layoffs or a possible transfer of staff to the US giant's Hong Kong offices, saying only that "adjustments" could be made "according to business demand."
Despite Google's promise of uncensored results, searches of politically sensitive key words generated the browser message "cannot display the web page" -- suggesting that China's "Great Firewall" of Internet control remained erect.
The futile search results applied for terms such as "Falun Gong", "Tibet riot" and "June 4" -- referring to the pro-democracy protests in 1989 on Beijing's Tiananmen Square.
Google's top lawyer David Drummond said the firm was "well aware that (China) could at any time block access to our services."
Despite yesterday's decision, Mr Drummond said Google plans to maintain its sales and research and development teams in China, which has the world's largest online population at 384 million.
Google launched Google.cn in January 2006 after agreeing to censor websites for content banned under Chinese law. Google.cn is the second-largest search engine in China after Chinese search engine Baidu.com.
A Chinese official in charge of the internet bureau of the State Council Information Office said that by ending censorship Google had "violated its written promise" to block controversial search results.
The world's search leader was "totally wrong" to stop censoring its Chinese-language search engine and to blame Beijing for the alleged hacker attacks, the official said.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/aus...food-for-thought/story-e6frgakx-1225844603380
- Correspondents in Washington
- From: AFP
- March 24, 2010 9:30AM
China, meanwhile, angrily attacked Google for stopping censorship of its Chinese-language search engine but said there should be no broader fallout in Sino-US ties provided there was no political meddling in the US.
US State Department spokesman Philip Crowley said the US respects but was "not party" to Google's decision to redirect search queries from mainland China to an uncensored site in Hong Kong.
While Washington stands for internet freedom, "individual businesses will make judgments as to the investment opportunity in China," he told reporters.
"We value the economic relationship between the US and China," Mr Crowley said, citing massive increases in trade over nearly three decades.
"That said, were I China, I would seriously consider the implications when one of the most recognizable institutions has decided that it's too difficult to do business in China," he said.
"And that has implications, but that ultimately is for China to evaluate," the State Department spokesman said.
In Beijing, officials reserved their ire for Google, which lifted censorship of its Chinese search engine, Google.cn, in response to cyberattacks last year which the company said targeted email accounts of Chinese rights activists.
"I don't see it influencing Sino-US relations unless some people want to politicise it," Chinese foreign ministry spokesman Qin Gang told reporters, describing the Google situation as "mainly an individual commercial case."
"If you link this to China-US relations or politicize it, or even link it to China's international image, this is mere overkill," Mr Qin said, adding: "China's market is fully open."
Google said it was "business as usual" at its China headquarters on Tuesday, as a fierce debate erupted online between Chinese defenders of free speech and nationalist-minded net users denouncing foreign interference.
Google spokeswoman Marsha Wang said she had no information about layoffs or a possible transfer of staff to the US giant's Hong Kong offices, saying only that "adjustments" could be made "according to business demand."
Despite Google's promise of uncensored results, searches of politically sensitive key words generated the browser message "cannot display the web page" -- suggesting that China's "Great Firewall" of Internet control remained erect.
The futile search results applied for terms such as "Falun Gong", "Tibet riot" and "June 4" -- referring to the pro-democracy protests in 1989 on Beijing's Tiananmen Square.
Google's top lawyer David Drummond said the firm was "well aware that (China) could at any time block access to our services."
Despite yesterday's decision, Mr Drummond said Google plans to maintain its sales and research and development teams in China, which has the world's largest online population at 384 million.
Google launched Google.cn in January 2006 after agreeing to censor websites for content banned under Chinese law. Google.cn is the second-largest search engine in China after Chinese search engine Baidu.com.
A Chinese official in charge of the internet bureau of the State Council Information Office said that by ending censorship Google had "violated its written promise" to block controversial search results.
The world's search leader was "totally wrong" to stop censoring its Chinese-language search engine and to blame Beijing for the alleged hacker attacks, the official said.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/aus...food-for-thought/story-e6frgakx-1225844603380
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IBM和MS公司的大老板，绝对没有谷哥儿这么高的西方民主政治觉悟和价值观。他们在政治问题上，绝对不去碰中国的底线。为什么？他们是去那里赚钱，不是去改变中国的政治、社会制度去了。改变他国政治、社会制度是美国政府和军队的任务，例如巴拿马、伊拉克。中国也可能会在他们的名单上，那是将来的事情。
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- 注册
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Google Partners Likely to Sever Links Over China Censorship Row
By Mark Lee, Bloomberg.com
March 24 (Bloomberg) -- Google Inc. partners in China are likely to follow billionaire Li Ka-shing’s lead and cut links with the U.S. Internet company after it defied the nation’s self-censorship rules.
Li’s Tom Online Inc. stopped using Google’s search engine on its portal and media buyer Zenith Optimedia said advertisers it represents may switch to rivals after Google began redirecting mainland users to an unfiltered offshore site this week. China Mobile Ltd. has a deal with Google to provide mobile and Internet services.
“All these guys will have to shy away from Google -- the government has made it quite clear it will not favor them,” said Paul Wuh, head of telecommunications and Internet research at Samsung Securities Co. in Hong Kong. “People will eventually stop using Google.”
Mountain View, California-based Google escalated a two- month censorship row with the government in the world’s biggest Internet market this week by routing China-based subscribers to a search service on its Hong Kong site. The move puts at risk business in China that JPMorgan Chase & Co. forecast could have generated $600 million of sales this year.
“If traffic at Google’s Hong Kong site is not as good as the Chinese site, advertisers will switch” to other online search providers, said Elinor Leung, head of Internet research at CLSA Ltd. Operators including Baidu Inc., Tencent Holdings, and Sohu.com Inc. will benefit, she said.
‘Effectively a Pullout’
“As far as the search business goes, the latest action is effectively a pullout from China,” said Steven Chang, the Shanghai-based chief executive officer for China at Zenith Optimedia, which buys advertising from Google and Baidu on behalf of clients. “Google’s value proposition to advertisers in China will have been diminished” by the move.
Baidu, operator of the country’s biggest search engine, rose $15.16, or 2.6 percent, to $594.88 at 4 p.m. New York time on the Nasdaq Stock Market. Sohu fell 57 cents to $54.19. Tencent, China’s biggest Internet company by value, rose 1.5 percent to close at HK$158.20 in Hong Kong yesterday.
Google said on Jan. 12 it was no longer willing to censor content on its Chinese site after it was targeted by cyber attacks from within China. Hackers obtained proprietary information and e-mail data of some human rights activists in a “highly sophisticated attack,” the company said at the time.
Users of the Google.cn Web site will be taken to the Google.com.hk site as the U.S. company seeks to operate an uncensored service in China that won’t infringe local laws, the Internet operator said March 22.
‘Totally Wrong’
Hong Kong has a separate government and economy, a legacy of the Chinese region’s status as a British territory until 1997, though mainland authorities have since exercised powers to reinterpret local statutes. At the handover of sovereignty, China promised to preserve Hong Kong’s capitalist system and free press for a further 50 years.
Google’s decision to stop filtering its site was totally wrong, the state-run Xinhua News Agency cited an official as saying this week. China censors online content it deems unacceptable by blocking offshore Web sites such as Youtube.com and Twitter.com.
Traffic redirected to Google’s Hong Kong site was still subject to Chinese government filters today. The site “is not currently blocked,” said Jay Nancarrow, a company spokesman. “It seems that certain sensitive queries are being blocked for users.”
Tom Online said it had removed Google from its Web site. It is using Baidu’s search services on its site today, though the unit of Hutchison Whampoa Ltd.’s Tom Group Ltd. was offering Google’s search engine last week.
China Mobile
“Our practice is to work with companies that are compliant with regulations,” said Elaine Feng, executive vice-president at Tom Online. She said the Chinese Internet company ended its relationship with Google after the expiry of an agreement, without giving details on the timing.
Google teamed with China Mobile in January 2007 to offer mobile and Internet services in the world’s most populous country. The U.S. firm also struck a partnership with Sina Corp. to provide search on China’s third-most visited Web portal.
Rainie Lei, spokeswoman at China Mobile, didn’t immediately reply to e-mail and phone messages seeking comment yesterday. Cathy Peng, a spokeswoman at Sina. declined to say if the company plans to retain its search agreement with Google.
Baidu, based in Beijing, accounted for 58.6 percent of China’s online search market last quarter, compared with 35.6 percent for Google, according to research company Analysys International.
Li, chairman of Hutchison Whampoa, is Hong Kong’s richest individual with wealth of $21 billion, according to a Forbes magazine survey.
To contact the reporter on this story: Mark Lee in Hong Kong at wlee37@bloomberg.net
Last Updated: March 23, 2010 21:54 EDT
By Mark Lee, Bloomberg.com
March 24 (Bloomberg) -- Google Inc. partners in China are likely to follow billionaire Li Ka-shing’s lead and cut links with the U.S. Internet company after it defied the nation’s self-censorship rules.
Li’s Tom Online Inc. stopped using Google’s search engine on its portal and media buyer Zenith Optimedia said advertisers it represents may switch to rivals after Google began redirecting mainland users to an unfiltered offshore site this week. China Mobile Ltd. has a deal with Google to provide mobile and Internet services.
“All these guys will have to shy away from Google -- the government has made it quite clear it will not favor them,” said Paul Wuh, head of telecommunications and Internet research at Samsung Securities Co. in Hong Kong. “People will eventually stop using Google.”
Mountain View, California-based Google escalated a two- month censorship row with the government in the world’s biggest Internet market this week by routing China-based subscribers to a search service on its Hong Kong site. The move puts at risk business in China that JPMorgan Chase & Co. forecast could have generated $600 million of sales this year.
“If traffic at Google’s Hong Kong site is not as good as the Chinese site, advertisers will switch” to other online search providers, said Elinor Leung, head of Internet research at CLSA Ltd. Operators including Baidu Inc., Tencent Holdings, and Sohu.com Inc. will benefit, she said.
‘Effectively a Pullout’
“As far as the search business goes, the latest action is effectively a pullout from China,” said Steven Chang, the Shanghai-based chief executive officer for China at Zenith Optimedia, which buys advertising from Google and Baidu on behalf of clients. “Google’s value proposition to advertisers in China will have been diminished” by the move.
Baidu, operator of the country’s biggest search engine, rose $15.16, or 2.6 percent, to $594.88 at 4 p.m. New York time on the Nasdaq Stock Market. Sohu fell 57 cents to $54.19. Tencent, China’s biggest Internet company by value, rose 1.5 percent to close at HK$158.20 in Hong Kong yesterday.
Google said on Jan. 12 it was no longer willing to censor content on its Chinese site after it was targeted by cyber attacks from within China. Hackers obtained proprietary information and e-mail data of some human rights activists in a “highly sophisticated attack,” the company said at the time.
Users of the Google.cn Web site will be taken to the Google.com.hk site as the U.S. company seeks to operate an uncensored service in China that won’t infringe local laws, the Internet operator said March 22.
‘Totally Wrong’
Hong Kong has a separate government and economy, a legacy of the Chinese region’s status as a British territory until 1997, though mainland authorities have since exercised powers to reinterpret local statutes. At the handover of sovereignty, China promised to preserve Hong Kong’s capitalist system and free press for a further 50 years.
Google’s decision to stop filtering its site was totally wrong, the state-run Xinhua News Agency cited an official as saying this week. China censors online content it deems unacceptable by blocking offshore Web sites such as Youtube.com and Twitter.com.
Traffic redirected to Google’s Hong Kong site was still subject to Chinese government filters today. The site “is not currently blocked,” said Jay Nancarrow, a company spokesman. “It seems that certain sensitive queries are being blocked for users.”
Tom Online said it had removed Google from its Web site. It is using Baidu’s search services on its site today, though the unit of Hutchison Whampoa Ltd.’s Tom Group Ltd. was offering Google’s search engine last week.
China Mobile
“Our practice is to work with companies that are compliant with regulations,” said Elaine Feng, executive vice-president at Tom Online. She said the Chinese Internet company ended its relationship with Google after the expiry of an agreement, without giving details on the timing.
Google teamed with China Mobile in January 2007 to offer mobile and Internet services in the world’s most populous country. The U.S. firm also struck a partnership with Sina Corp. to provide search on China’s third-most visited Web portal.
Rainie Lei, spokeswoman at China Mobile, didn’t immediately reply to e-mail and phone messages seeking comment yesterday. Cathy Peng, a spokeswoman at Sina. declined to say if the company plans to retain its search agreement with Google.
Baidu, based in Beijing, accounted for 58.6 percent of China’s online search market last quarter, compared with 35.6 percent for Google, according to research company Analysys International.
Li, chairman of Hutchison Whampoa, is Hong Kong’s richest individual with wealth of $21 billion, according to a Forbes magazine survey.
To contact the reporter on this story: Mark Lee in Hong Kong at wlee37@bloomberg.net
Last Updated: March 23, 2010 21:54 EDT
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对此，我不做推论。我只是把刚刚搜索到的有关谷歌的几家大的通讯社的消息贴出来给你们的讨论添油加醋。至于他们报道的可靠性和正确性由你们决定
It's just for fun. To be serious, will this in or out affect my life? The answer is no. I like what Joe Wang said in his show, that I just saw in this website, for a slogan that will be used for being a candidate for the President, he would use "Who cares". It's fun, isn't it? "Who cares" can have a period as an end or a question mark. That is interesting!
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对此，我不做推论。我只是把刚刚搜索到的有关谷歌的几家大的通讯社的消息贴出来给你们的讨论添油加醋。至于他们报道的可靠性和正确性由你们决定
那么长的文字，哪里有时间看啊。再说了，我看也未必看得出个名堂。
村长，你是不是文艺界的？ 是导演吧？ 怎么听这象在给年轻演员灌输潜规则的理论？
呵，二位忘记看我的签名了吧？
老Ｖ开了个帖，俺得捧场。是吧？
