有谁知道Minto Acadia那边（Scotia bank place北）新房的地基是否会有沉降问题？

[闲丸]

I would like to put my comments on this as below.
The minimum bearing capacity in Ottawa is 5ton/sm, ...

这位仁兄是业内人士吧。非常非常感谢你的comments。
有一点点没有看明白，你说的是最重要的是房子的drainage要好，但是如果房子的drainage不好，我理解水也许会进入地基下面，然后会带来什么样的问题呢？Uneven settlement？如果地基的surground被铺了gravel，仍然会存在这个问题么？（抱歉如果我问的是stupid question），非常感谢！

 

[闲丸]

From Fengshui point of view, houses located on highest lots and lowest lots in the community are not good. The risks could be wind (causing roof problem), lightning (fire) and drainage (water).

恩，这是我们没想过的！风水我们实在是不懂。谢谢你的提醒！

 

[闲丸]

就是这个意思!! 越是豪宅, 买家越挑剔, 地板的木料, 瓷砖的品质, 橱柜的颜色, 家电的配置, etc., 甚至owner home staging的品位都可能影响买家的决定.
…… 只要是学区内, 房价能省就省了.

我们确实考虑过这点，因为如果买贵的房子，那么就没钱upgrade了。因此整个房子内部装修的水平就较低。不太符合“高档房”的在以后潜在买家心中的定位。而且我们也是无意中和两家也在考虑（或者已经买了）Cardel/Uniform房子的人聊了一下，一个中国家庭，一家中东家庭。他们似乎真的是不差钱的。70w左右的房子，还在计划大价钱upgrade。不知道这样的人在Richardson Ridge有多少比例。曾经听说Kanata Lakes以及周边的家庭的品均收入是14.3w。

另外，你说到了学区，Minto跟我说Acadia小区正在计划建一个English Public School，预计在今天9月份announce，2014年open。如果真的这样计划的，不知道会因为这个小学的建立而改变学区的划分么？

 

[闲丸]

Just in case you have not read this...

Personally I would pay more attention to the noise coming from HW-417..and potential heavy local traffic by the upcmoming outlet mall...

http://webcast.ottawa.ca/plan/All_I...ference_Planning Rationale D02-02-11-0036.PDF
....
Geotechnical Study – Paterson Group, July 2007
.

非常感谢小宝妈的信息！
我确实看到过这份文件。这份文件是关于居民区南的那片mix商业用地的。但我相信地质结构来说，居民区和商业区应该差异不大。IBI和Paterson给出了他们对drainage和fundation建设的建议。
关于Foundation:
从我的minto project manager那里得到了一点信息，她提到Minto和city共同以building code为依据制定过一分protocol。详细描述了在sensitiv clay上建房的工艺细节。她的“口径”和sales基本一致，就是“要相信Minto的施工质量，每一步都是层层把关的”。而且就sale所说，Orleans的Avalon community也是clay based，就是执行的这一protocol，到目前为止我还没有听到过Avalon社区关于因沉降而damage地基信息。

关于drainage，
看似Acadia小区北部的pond确实是按照IBI的建议为了drainage而做的。但是按照Foundation仁兄的观点，possibility study都是基于历史1：50的洪水而设计的。如果百年一遇的洪水真的来了（就像今年百年一遇的大旱刚走），这里也许将会是灾区。

总的来说，我其实相信像minto这种规模的公司，应该不会故意为了降低成本而不顾产品质量。但是不能不承认Acadia这个社区出问题的风险确实比Richardson Ridge大一些。Builder会建设各种设施来减小这个风险，可就怕有个万一。

 

[闲丸]

44跟50的房子地皮差价应该是5万，standard应该是2万，3万就算是花在稍微远离垃圾山的代价上面。

我个人是会选Cardel或者Uniform的房子。

谢谢建议！44x101和50x105的地的面积差15%左右，价格会差到5w么？

 

[foundation]

here are my comments

Let me try to answer your questions as below including the question raised to me in QQH.

1)Let us see In case the drainage is not good. Whether or not the rain will intrude into the subgrade depends on how heavy the rain will be. Once the total weight of your house is less than the buoyancy (just assume the area of the house become a pond, and then it will have buoyancy for anything in the pond), and there is no rain intruding into the subgrade. Otherwise, the rain will intrude into the subgrade (less chance for this situation). If this situation really happens, then within 33% compression of the rigid insulation will cancel part or all (depends water contents in the subgrade) deformation due to frost heave in the winter, and the rest of deformation will be transferred to foundation wall, if this force is big enough, then the foundation wall will be bent somewhere, which we can call uneven settlement.

The gravel underneath of footing wall will reduce the accumulation of rain, but putting gravel underneath of all footing wall will be much more expensive, I personally do not think the developer will do it.

2) The PDF file you have shown me does not include the geotechnical report, the two reports included are BIOLOGICAL Report and Geotechnical slope report. Whether or not the subgrade can take the upper load will be specified in the geotechnical report as bearing capacity in the suggested soil layer. But you can do your own calculations for the total load on the subgrade based on 20lbs/sf on roof, 40lbs/sf on floor, 10lbs/sf on siding, it will give you rough idea how heavy your building is, I am pretty sure, it will be less than 50kpa(5ton/sqm).

Good luck

这位仁兄是业内人士吧。非常非常感谢你的comments。

有一点点没有看明白，你说的是最重要的是房子的drainage要好，但是如果房子的drainage不好，我理解水也许会进入地基下面，然后会带来什么样的问题呢？Uneven settlement？如果地基的surground被铺了gravel，仍然会存在这个问题么？（抱歉如果我问的是stupid question），非常感谢！

 

[闲丸]

以下是Minto soil consultant给我的答复，关于地基沉降：

The “foam pylons” referred to by the sales rep. is actually blocks of high density, but low weight expanded polystyrene foam. The foam is used as “lightweight fill” to replace heavy granular fill materials under garage and porch slabs where it is necessary to reduce the weight within the garage and porch to reduce differential settlement. This treatment is used where the soil conditions warrant it and will not be required for much of the Arcadia development.

All soils are susceptible to some amount of settlement when structures, such as houses, are constructed on them. The settlement of a house foundation is considered to be within the ”normal” range when the total settlement does not exceed 25 mm (1”) and the differential settlement between parts of the foundation does not exceed 20 mm (3/4”).

The basement floor is a non-structural part of the house and minor cracking should not be of concern. Most basement floors have some cracks, whether they are located in a sensitive clay area or not. Commonly the cracks are caused by normal “shrinkage” of the concrete as it sets, but they can also be caused by normal settlement of the foundations. Typically if the cracks are narrow, as you described, and no differential movement occurs across the crack they are not a repair issue.

 

[foundation]

when we talk about settlement, the settlements under garage and porch slabs are not our concern. the concern for the settlement is under the FOUNDATION WALL above which the exterior walls are supported. so the comments below from builder does not say anything useful. the max. settlement mentioned in the letter is the same with my first post. but it is the settlement due to gravity of house and settlement of soil, it is not related to the settlement caused by lower elevation-the rain-bad drainage-frost heave-different settlement under ther footing. so their mentioned settlement is not what we are talking about.

以下是Minto soil consultant给我的答复，关于地基沉降：



The “foam pylons” referred to by the sales rep. is actually blocks of high density, but low weight expanded polystyrene foam. The foam is used as “lightweight fill” to replace heavy granular fill materials under garage and porch slabs where it is necessary to reduce the weight within the garage and porch to reduce differential settlement. This treatment is used where the soil conditions warrant it and will not be required for much of the Arcadia development.



All soils are susceptible to some amount of settlement when structures, such as houses, are constructed on them. The settlement of a house foundation is considered to be within the ”normal” range when the total settlement does not exceed 25 mm (1”) and the differential settlement between parts of the foundation does not exceed 20 mm (3/4”).



The basement floor is a non-structural part of the house and minor cracking should not be of concern. Most basement floors have some cracks, whether they are located in a sensitive clay area or not. Commonly the cracks are caused by normal “shrinkage” of the concrete as it sets, but they can also be caused by normal settlement of the foundations. Typically if the cracks are narrow, as you described, and no differential movement occurs across the crack they are not a repair issue.

 

[greenhand]

这贴子再看下去, 心脏真有点受不了. 我们是pre-Sales时看了眼, 一开盘就签约了, 啥垃圾山/鲤鱼河的都没考虑过, 觉得这么大的builder, 质量应该会有保证. 退一步说, 这小区要造几年, 即使房子有问题, 随时可找builder修理, 工地上一直有人, 不用等啊约啊浪费时间. 当初如果做了这么些功课的话, 可能也不会在这里买房了.

留心这块地有几年了, 进出高速方便, 又将建outlet, 将来还有商业楼, 挺方便挺热闹的. 以后老人来了, 白天可以溜商店, 不会太寂寞. 自己最好在家门口的办公楼里找份工作, 天天走着上班, 既健康又环保, 还省了养车的开销.

说到学区, 我们基本定位在HWY417北面, 既可以去Leacok, 又可以去Earl of March, 新区那个教会高中也不错. 我是上周末刚知道小区里要造小学, 销售说是proposal, 我估计不会这么快建起来, 其他新区一般建到50%以上才会有学校, 否则哪里来这么多孩子上学. 我家孩子上EFI, English Public School对我们影响不大. 而EFI的学区, 实在很难说, 一直在变, HWY 417北面小学总体质量还行, 应该不用太担心.

 

[greenhand]

如果不差钱, 一定会买Cardel or Uniform的房子，无论是风水还是排水, 房子造在高地上总比建在农田上好很多. 但是问题就是钱啊, 不仅是房价和升级, 周围邻居都花大笔银子装修, 即使是裸房, 地税也照涨不误. 以后有钱的邻居要装高级fence, 门口要搞landscaping, 我多少也要搞搞吧, 要维护社区形象不是? 想到这些, 心理压力实在太大了.
我还是住工人新村, 享受温馨的小家就好.

 

[小地主]

...

另外，你说到了学区，Minto跟我说Acadia小区正在计划建一个English Public School，预计在今天9月份announce，2014年open。如果真的这样计划的，不知道会因为这个小学的建立而改变学区的划分么？

这个新学校一建，无论你买RICHARDSON RIDGE还是ACADIA没有区别。。。小孩子都去那了。。新的SCHOOL BOUNDARY都在HIDDEN AGANDA里划好了。。。

就是GOULBOURN FORCED RD以西，KANATA AVENUE以北，TERRY FOX EXTENSION 以南。。。包括了现在的KANATA ESTATES／KIZELL POND；RICHARDSON RIDGE；＂NEW＂ HERITAGE HILLS，ACADIA这些近几年来发展起的小区。。。

新小学其实没什么不好，新校舍，新设施，DUAL TRACKS。。。但是如果这个BOUNDARY做实了，随着７，８年级从小学并入高中（明年？），EARL OF MARCH的CAPACITY再加EXTENSION也赶不上DEMOGRAPHIC的变化（这些新小区都是相对的YOUNG NEIGHBORHOOD），总有达临界点的时候。。。那时候高中学区的重新划分就有问题了。。。

不过也不用想那么多。。实在不行就再搬次家。。

前一段看到CATHY CURRY辞职了。。在她的任内KANATA（南北加起来），总共建了四个PUBLIC SCHOOLS(算上这ACADIA这个)。。两个在MINTO的COMMUNITIES。。我看她可以去MINTO当个DIRECTOR了。。。

 

[闲丸]

when we talk about settlement, the settlements under garage and porch slabs are not our concern. ... so their mentioned settlement is not what we are talking about.

谢谢！！
似乎听Minto的说法，地下那层foam不是铺在整个地基下面。而且“不是每个房子都需要”，似乎那目的并不是想咱们之前讨论的吸收frost heave的膨胀力。也就是说，如果某个房子下面恰好被认为不需要这个foam，那么全部的frost heave导致的deformation都会被加在地基上？

 

[greenhand]

朋友说, 以后Lakes的好学校也不会像现在这么拥挤了, 因为没有多少年轻的家庭能负担得起70W以上的房子了. Townhouse都要卖30-40W, 本地人宁可住远点, 买独立房了.

 

[foundation]

And I do not think the Minto soil consultant fully understands why the Foam is provided only under the slab of garage and porch. it is not because it can replace the heavy granular fill materials. it is because these areas are not heated areas, the foam is used to stop frost heave applied to the slab in these unheated area. the picture as shown is standard detail for the slab on grade in unheated area, you can see from there that the granular fill will be provided right underneath of 3" foam. they act for different purpose.

hope this is useful.

以下是Minto soil consultant给我的答复，关于地基沉降：



The “foam pylons” referred to by the sales rep. is actually blocks of high density, but low weight expanded polystyrene foam. The foam is used as “lightweight fill” to replace heavy granular fill materials under garage and porch slabs where it is necessary to reduce the weight within the garage and porch to reduce differential settlement. This treatment is used where the soil conditions warrant it and will not be required for much of the Arcadia development.



All soils are susceptible to some amount of settlement when structures, such as houses, are constructed on them. The settlement of a house foundation is considered to be within the ”normal” range when the total settlement does not exceed 25 mm (1”) and the differential settlement between parts of the foundation does not exceed 20 mm (3/4”).



The basement floor is a non-structural part of the house and minor cracking should not be of concern. Most basement floors have some cracks, whether they are located in a sensitive clay area or not. Commonly the cracks are caused by normal “shrinkage” of the concrete as it sets, but they can also be caused by normal settlement of the foundations. Typically if the cracks are narrow, as you described, and no differential movement occurs across the crack they are not a repair issue.

 

[闲丸]

也就是说如果房子重量小于5ton/sqm，那就不会有太大的风险了？因为bouyancy会大于房子重力？
我考虑的房型，地基是36'x59’=2124sqf=197.3sqm。粗略的估计，地下室2000sqf，一层2000sqf（含车库），二层1650sqf。roof大约2000sqf。（我不知道40lb/sqf是否应该重复计算一层和二层的面积，但是如果不重复计算，数字距离5ton/sqm太远，所以估计那是不对的）按照你下面的计算公式
重量大约是20(roof)x2000 + 40(foor) x (2000+2000+1650) +10(siding)x2000=286000lbs=129.7ton

所以最后的数值<1ton/sqm，也就是说没有什么问题了？
（也不知道我瞎算的对不对。这方面知识实在是太少了，真是书到用时方恨少啊！）

Let me try to answer your questions as below including the question raised to me in QQH.

1)Let us see In case the drainage is not good. Whether or not the rain will intrude into the subgrade depends on how heavy the rain will be. Once the total weight of your house is less than the buoyancy (just assume the area of the house become a pond, and then it will have buoyancy for anything in the pond), and there is no rain intruding into the subgrade. Otherwise, the rain will intrude into the subgrade (less chance for this situation). If this situation really happens, then within 33% compression of the rigid insulation will cancel part or all (depends water contents in the subgrade) deformation due to frost heave in the winter, and the rest of deformation will be transferred to foundation wall, if this force is big enough, then the foundation wall will be bent somewhere, which we can call uneven settlement.

The gravel underneath of footing wall will reduce the accumulation of rain, but putting gravel underneath of all footing wall will be much more expensive, I personally do not think the developer will do it.

2) The PDF file you have shown me does not include the geotechnical report, the two reports included are BIOLOGICAL Report and Geotechnical slope report. Whether or not the subgrade can take the upper load will be specified in the geotechnical report as bearing capacity in the suggested soil layer. But you can do your own calculations for the total load on the subgrade based on 20lbs/sf on roof, 40lbs/sf on floor, 10lbs/sf on siding, it will give you rough idea how heavy your building is, I am pretty sure, it will be less than 50kpa(5ton/sqm).

Good luck