精华 [讨论] 家庭暴力

你说的话...
最初由 Wanderer 发布


我前面的几个贴子里一直在强调:家庭暴力的定义,地域,和文化背景。在中国,小两口打架可能不是什么大问题,特别是当打架的频度不高时。两个不同生活背景的人开始厮守在一起,可能会有很多磕磕碰碰。如果双方都努力,磕磕碰碰会减少,家庭和睦会到来。

移民加拿大后,每个人都要调整自己去适应加拿大的环境。如果在中国不是什么大不了的事而到加拿大后立刻想到要用法律手段解决,特别是当不了解法律保护的结果时,移民们很可能在用法律手段寻求他们最不希望看到的结果。

因此,当我们谈法律保护的时候,我们是否也应该想到:我们是否能接受其保护的结果?如果我们不喜欢这个结果,我们是不是在用法律手段给自己找不痛快?

有些道理,看看调查报告是怎么写的...

最初由 chef 发布
...
自从发生过多次报警,因警方没有采取措施,事后女方被杀事件后,警方对家庭暴力案件已相当重视了。只要有人报警,警察都会立即赶到现场,察看女方有无被殴打的痕迹。即使女方改变主意,警察也会像对待刑事犯一样,给男人戴上手铐,带回警察局录口供,拍照,打指模,绝非夫妻床头打架床尾和解那样简单了事。

另外,警方要看女方的伤势来决定丈夫的命运,那些情节较轻的候审丈夫,每周都要到中心接受一次心理辅导,每次1至2小时,总共16次。张先生介绍说,仅华人家庭服务中心一年就要接到几百个家庭暴力案子,其中60%的
夫妇事后仍生活在一起,有些丈夫经过教育后改了打人的毛病,有些则变本加厉打得更凶。
...
 
不是说一定就要通过法律解决问题.看看

1.你的好友
2.你的其他家庭成员
3.你所在的社区服务中心
4.你的同事
5.你常去的教会
6.你参加的社团组织
7.你的家庭医生
8.你可以借助的媒体(网,报纸甚至电视)
...
能不能帮助你.
 
您总是纠缠细节,这是上海人的通病吗?
我把统计都贴上来了,您应该看完了再下结论。家庭暴力当然影响所有人,但是80%以上的家庭暴力的受害者是妇女,大家都明白,您也就就没必要反过来掉过去地为男同胞申诉了。OK, 就到这里吧。

您说应该与人为善,要有爱心,家庭才能和睦,为什么?
还有“一个离婚家庭本身就是个失败的人生“,是吗?

最初由 kool 发布

你的辩论上一直在明显的错误引导别人。。你却忽略了这些法律的制定不是但为女人的。。如果您在家里或单位对男人这样也是属于abuse, 你经常 humiliating me, insulting me, telling what I can do on this website!..are u abuse me??

不是我想和你争论, 我说了你一开始就是把男人放在你的对立面, 当成阶级敌人在批斗。。没矛盾也会出矛盾, 本来有矛盾的也会更加恶化。。。

这些都不是解决家庭问题的根本。。真的应该少点自私。。与人为善, 具有爱心。。付起家庭责任才是应该做的。。虽然你可能会说我在说大道理, 其实并不然。。我们真的应该这么做。。

一个离婚家庭本身就是个失败的人生, 无法经营自己的家庭就象经营一个自己辛苦创业的公司破了产一样, 成功的家庭就象营利的企业。。不但各种关系处理的好, 更是蒸蒸日上。。还是老话说的好。。家和万事兴<<< 在这点上双方都有着他们的牺牲和责任
 
How do you distinguish 磕磕碰碰 from domestic violence?

I think you exaggerated the cultural differences between a Chinese family and a Canadian family. I can tell you this, when it comes to abuse, there is very little differences between a Chinese woman and a Canadian woman. Many studies have already done on this subject, I'll not repeat myself here. If you are truly interested and want to find out more, use the links I posted in previous posts, or use google.

The law must be clearly defined, there must be a clear-cut line, therefore beating your wife is against Canadian law. However in real life, normal people would use their common-sense first. I have repeatedly underlined the importance of common-sense, because I feel that many don't know what is common-sense anymore. I believe that a woman KNOWS what is 磕磕碰碰, and what is domestic abuse. So when she's being beaten up to the point that she would call police, then an act of abuse has been committed.

Unlike many law-lacking countries, women in Canada at least have the option to seek police help. Don't you think that they should be given that option?

In reality, many women immigrants would rather hide their beatings than to seek help, any kind of help. One of the goals I set to start this post is to provide information to women in an abusive relationship.

Of course with every decision comes a consequence. So next time when you decide to give your wife a few slaps just for the heck of it, think about the consequences first.


最初由 Wanderer 发布


我前面的几个贴子里一直在强调:家庭暴力的定义,地域,和文化背景。在中国,小两口打架可能不是什么大问题,特别是当打架的频度不高时。两个不同生活背景的人开始厮守在一起,可能会有很多磕磕碰碰。如果双方都努力,磕磕碰碰会减少,家庭和睦会到来。

移民加拿大后,每个人都要调整自己去适应加拿大的环境。如果在中国不是什么大不了的事而到加拿大后立刻想到要用法律手段解决,特别是当不了解法律保护的结果时,移民们很可能在用法律手段寻求他们最不希望看到的结果。

因此,当我们谈法律保护的时候,我们是否也应该想到:我们是否能接受其保护的结果?如果我们不喜欢这个结果,我们是不是在用法律手段给自己找不痛快?
 
Yes. Male victims account for about 11% of all domestic violence, mostly young males. Read the statistics I posted.

Increasingly today, "battered husband" has become a significant social issue. The issue of husband abuse is sharply divided among researchers, with one group argues that husband abuse is no different from wife abuse, while others argue that it is different in many ways.

If you are really curious about husband abuse, come here:

Husband Abuse: An Overview of Research and Perspectives


最初由 红颜知己 发布
是不是打人都不对,不论男方女方?我很好奇,假如是妻子打了丈夫,男方报案,是不是一样要把女方抓起来呢?
 
This is a tough one. Researchers have found some correlation between violence and the following factors:

1. Poverty
2. Men's natural will of dominance control of power
3. Childhood development difficulties leading to mental illness
4. Substance abuse, i.e. alcohol & drugs


最初由 shusheng 发布


Yes and yes.

On the other hand, I would also like to see discusstion about WHY "家庭暴力" happens?
 
能不能探讨一下解决的办法呀!看的已经够慎人的了.
 
The Women’s Greatest Fears

Given these realities, immigrant and refugee women live with many real fears. One is the fear of deportation, for themselves, for their children or for their husband. Even if the women sponsored their husbands, because they often do not know their rights, they fear that they could be deported if they report their husband, or in some other way “cause trouble” in their new country.

One example of fear for a woman whose husband is a refugee claimant is that he will be deported if a criminal charge is laid against him for assaulting her. According to Employment and Immigration Canada (EIC), this fear is unfounded for several reasons. EIC representatives take the legal position that deportation, if it does occur, will more likely be the result of the claimant being found not to be a refugee. In addition, the laying of criminal charges is not a reason for depor tation, even if the claimant is found to be a refugee. A person who is eventually determined to be a Convention refugee cannot be removed to the country of persecution. However, a Convention refugee convicted of a serious crime does not have the right to have an application for permanent resident processed in Canada.

As well, a woman who does not make her own claim for refugee status may fear that she will be deported with her husband if he is convicted of abusing her. EIC points out that, according to immigration legislation, every individual over the age of 18 is entitled to a full hearing at an inquiry and is not automatically deported. Children under the age of 18 are provided adequate legal counsel if their parents so choose. Furthermore, EIC advised that any woman who has a basis for making a claim to refugee status should make her own claim rather than linking her claim to that of her husband.

Women who have been sponsored by their husbands fear that if they break the conditions of sponsorship, they will be unable to obtain Canadian citizenship themselves, and that their husband’s chances will also be jeopardized. However, according to EIC, sponsorship breakdown does not jeopardize the sponsor’s nor the immigrant’s ability to obtain Canadian citizenship. The responsibilities of sponsorship rest with the sponsor only and not with the immigrant. EIC makes it clear that an immigrant woman cannot be held responsible for a sponsorship breakdown.

Women fear that their husbands could get custody of the children if the abuse becomes public knowledge. They also feel that they could seriously jeopardize their children’s futures by depriving them of a parent, if they were to make the decision to leave home with the children, Women who come from cultures where separation or divorce can result in great loss of family reputation may fear that they will deprive their children of the opportunity to marry at all or to marry well within their culture.

In cultures where a stigma is attached to “troubled relationships” and to women who do not take responsibility for the happiness and survival of the marriage, women who are abused fear accusations that they have brought shame on the community, and they fear the ostracism from friends and family members that can result.

Within this context, women may fear the individualized approach often taken in this country to deal with violence. They see themselves as part of a wider family and sometimes also a wider community. These women may see efforts to encourage them to take advantage of counselling for themselves as ways to separate them from their families or communities, and as selfish and irresponsible ways of approaching their pain.

Women fear that they will be unable to survive if they leave their husbands or if their husbands are put in jail. Especially for women with little or no employment history and few or no skills in French or English, this fear is well founded on reality.

Many immigrant and refugee women fear involvement with the justice system, often because of their experiences with police as a repressive force in their country of origin, sometimes because of the fear that involvement with the justice system will mean deportation, often because the justice system is intimidating, and because many immigrant and visible minority women and men report experiences of racism from justice system representatives, according to those interviewed for this report.

The Women’s Hopes and Dreams

Many immigrant women and men come to a new country to give their children a better life. This hope can become their reason for survival and a reason for enduring hardship. Abuse, in this context, can become just another of the hardships the woman feels she must endure for her children’s sake. The Women’s Needs This summary of some of the realities of immigrant and refugee women who are abused points to a broad spectrum of needs. Many-of these needs are identical to the needs of all battered women. However, the intensity of these needs, given the intensity of the isolation, fear and powerlessness of many immigrant and refugee women, is often much more acute. In addition, people interviewed stressed that the needs of immigrant and refugee women who are battered cannot be separated from the needs of immigrant and refugee women more generally. The disadvantaged and isolated lives of many immigrant and refugee women reduce the choices available to them and increase their vulnerability and entrapment when they live with an abusive partner.

The primary needs of immigrant and refugee women who are battered, as identified by women and men interviewed for this project, are summarized below.

1. Above all, immigrant and refugee women need to be informed of their rights and the laws pertaining to wife assault and immigration status.

2. People interviewed also stressed the overwhelming need for a supportive network to provide understanding and caring as well as a sense of greater freedom and confirmation that she is not alone.

3. Immigrant and refugee women who are abused need the opportunity to discuss and reassess their beliefs and assumptions concerning wife abuse, but they need to be able to talk about these issues with women and men who understand their culture and who can communicate in their language.

4. Immigrant and refugee women also need subsidized language-training classes with training allowances and free day care facilities. Because women are often sponsored by their husbands, and their husbands have made a legal undertaking to provide for their needs during the sponsorship period (up to 10 years), they are ineligible for basic training allowances while they attend language training. Under this arrangement, the woman is legally dependent on her husband and this dependence enforces her social and emotional isolation which intensifies her abuse. Certainly, settlement languagetraining programs are available for women not in the labour market, and for women who have been sponsored by their husbands, but these are part-time courses which provide on-site babysitting and transportation costs where necessary, but which do not provide training allowances. One respondent commented that these courses are seen as “secondclass classes” which through subject matter and orientation reinforce women’s dependent status and traditional female roles.

5. Immigrant and refugee women need culturally sensitive, multicultural, multilingual and multiracial child care facilities to enable them to break the isolation so many suffer.

6. There is an urgent need for more job-training courses and for a wider variety of such training courses, especially for women who do not have language skills in either English or French. Currently, some immigrant women’s programs, settlement agencies and ethnocultural agencies offer job-training courses, but the funding is limited, the programs can serve only a small number of women and few programs are available that accept women without language skills in one of the two official languages in Canada.

7. Immigrant and refugee women need affordable, good housing to give them the choice to leave an abusive partner. Although this is a general problem for women across Canada, because immigrant and refugee women often have no family or friends to rely on, their need for housing can be more urgent.

8. Immigrant and refugee women need more services available in their own languages and with sensitivity to their culture, to address their legal, economic, safety and support needs.

Isolated, Afraid and Forgotten: The Service Delivery Needs and Realities of Immigrant and Refugee Women Who Are Battered
 
This is what discussion is all about. First we identify the problem, then we discuss possible cause and solutions.

I think we know now that domestic abuse is a serious problem, but what are the cause of it? Do you have any thoughts?


最初由 chef 发布
能不能探讨一下解决的办法呀!看的已经够慎人的了.
 
找办法解决远比找到原因重要的多.
 
在知道自己的权利后,她们仍不去寻求保护的原因,除了惧怕以外,还有没有别的呢?
 
最初由 渐渐 发布
How do you distinguish 磕磕碰碰 from domestic violence?

磕磕碰碰 to me means the different opinions between a couple and the different problem-solving methods which he/she like to use. I was intending to get into the next step:

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最初由 shusheng 发布
On the other hand, I would also like to see discusstion about WHY "家庭暴力" happens?
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When 磕磕碰碰 happens, you could say out straight your opinions and insist on your methods to solve problems (because you have use them for long time and the methods did work for you), at the same time you have to think about what your husband/wife's thoughts and feelings. Could he/she be able to take your opinions, and could he/she be able to accept your methods? He/she might not be, even the words which you used to explain your opinions.

Discussion could happen between a couple, but we have to know how to make the discussion to happen in a talkable situation. Otherwise, the 磕磕碰碰 might go into family fighting or violence.

On the other hand, the man of a traditional family always has more responsibility on the family issues. He is supposed to solve more family problems than his wife. If he has to take more responsibility and can not make more decissions, what can he do? Family fighting could be a simple solution for past many years, but now he has to find other ways because of civilization. My question is what wife should do, only take decission power from her husband?
 
I diagree, without knowing the root cause of a problem, it's impossible to solve it.

最初由 chef 发布
找办法解决远比找到原因重要的多.
 
可是谁结婚是为了挨打得? 听话的不挨打.

最初由 丫丫 发布

:flaming: 这是一种非常无耻的逻辑:flaming:

对不起,俺骂人了,可是,俺不准备收回:smokin:
 
Ok your definition of 磕磕碰碰 is not far from mine, normal family dispute is what I'd define it. However normal family dispute that escalates to the use of physical force is considered abuse. Again, I urge you to use common-sense.

In response to the case you described below, you should treat your wife as EQUAL party. Equality for many Chinese men are merely punch words, but don't actually mean anything. Members of the family should share equal responsiblities and make joint decisions together. Why should men be the ones making all the decisions? Why would men take more responsiblity for family problems? Would that be a normal family?


最初由 Wanderer 发布
On the other hand, the man of a traditional family always has more responsibility on the family issues. He is supposed to solve more family problems than his wife. If he has to take more responsibility and can not make more decissions, what can he do? Family fighting could be a simple solution for past many years, but now he has to find other ways because of civilization. My question is what wife should do, only take decission power from her husband?
 
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